Thoughts on Game 4
Why Boston won Game 4?
Focus and desire
The Celtics refused to lose Game 4 and a ton of credit goes to Doc Rivers. He remained positive throughout and did not panic. His smooth demeanor in the face of a huge deficit gave his team a base to build up from. And boy, did it work.
Celtics know how to ride that roller coaster
The one thing a fan will never understand is the emotional ride a player competing at this level goes through. The great thing about the NBA is that the 24-second shot clock allows that ride to be even more emotional.
The Lakers and their fans were having a good time in the first two and half quarters. Kobe Bryant was smiling and talking smack, Lamar Odom was dancing, Pau Gasol was strutting. Meanwhile the Celtics were looking grim as can be. They were spooked and embarrassed and their body language showed it.
Fast forward to the fourth quarter when the Celtics finally took the lead (after trailing by 24 points) on an Eddie House jumper and the looks were magically transferred to the faces of the Lakers and their fans.
Now you know why this game puts wrinkles on coaches’ faces and induces players to leave their skin and act out of character in anger. That’s the part of basketball I will never miss and the Lakers paid a serious price for falling into it.
Kobe had no rhythm
Although the Lakers were rolling early, I had a problem with the fact Bryant was not in the flow. Why? Because the same players that were rolling early for the Lakers were not closers and historically those guys become resistant to shooting when the game becomes intense. So by Kobe having no rhythm, I felt the Celtics had a chance if they got the deficit to 10 by the fourth quarter. Well, they got it to two and that spelled doom for the Lakers with Kobe struggling to carry them home.
Celtics’ bench continues to dominate
There’s one big difference between Eddie House, James Posey and Sam Cassell and the Lakers’ bench (with the exception of Sasha Vujacic)… The Celtics guys don’t care if they fail. Those guys could miss 10 straight shots and still shoot. They are tough minded and strong willed and that is why I felt they would hold the edge in this series. And they have. 29 points combined from House and Posey were huge in the comeback and solidified who has the most productive bench in this series.
Celtic defense
I told my wife at halftime that if the Celtics could hold the Lakers to 90 points, they would win the game. She looked at me like I was crazy, but I knew that the Celtics are the only team in the league other than San Antonio that could shut the Lakers down and still have the ability to score enough to make up a huge deficit.
This win was incredible. They held the Lakers to 33 points in the second half and yet everyone claims that they are the best offensive team in the league. I guess we now know who has the best offense. The Celtics have cold-blooded scorers in Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, House, Cassell and Posey. These guys don’t care about shot attempts whereas Kobe, Vujacic and sometimes Derek Fisher seem to be the only aggressive-minded scorers for the Lakers.
Ray Allen shuts up his critics
Allen has been huge and is making a run at securing MVP honors for the series after averaging 20 points and 6 rebounds over the first four games. Allen made two huge drives down the stretch to get the win. His effort on defense against Kobe this series has been great.
Star of game: James Posey was huge because he kept the Celtics in range with three-point shots during a period when the Lakers would build the lead back to high-double figures. He has been the unsung hero for most of the playoffs, but his 18 points in Game 4 elevated him to star over teammate Paul Pierce, who did double duty by giving Ray Allen a breather guarding Kobe in the second half.
Turning point: The second quarter was significant because the Celtics started making runs and although the Lakers would repel them, they would come right back. I felt these runs and the calmness of Doc Rivers finally got them a 21 to 3 run late in the third quarter that made it a two-point game entering the fourth quarter. They never quit and the Lakers paid the ultimate price.
Unsung hero: Eddie House is the perfect offensive role player. He reminds me so much of… Well, me! He has never met a shot he didn’t like and he has supreme confidence. I understand why Doc Rivers contemplates at times if he should use him, but I think Rivers realizes now why he shouldn’t contemplate. House is not afraid to fail and that is why he has survived in this league and was huge in the Celtic comeback scoring 11 points.
Who needs to step up for Game 5?
Los Angeles Lakers:
Kobe can’t wait any longer. Although the Lakers built a huge lead, they did it with non closers and when those same guys needed to continue they shied away and deferred to an out-of-rhythm Bryant. Jackson can’t afford to ignore Kobe within that triangle for a half and expect him to be ready to finish the game with confidence against this stingy defense.
The Lakers’ bench has turned out as I expected. I said in my preview that inexperience would do them in and it has been true to form.
Boston Celtics:
If Kevin Garnett wants to solidify his career, here is his opportunity. Paul Pierce has stepped up big, Allen has been great and now the icing on the cake is for Garnett to have the game of his life and live up to the
greatness everyone has expected of him.
Game 5 strategy
Los Angeles Lakers:
- Must play a solid 48 minutes against a hungry Celtic team.
- Kobe must be aggressive from the start.
- Pressure guards continuously full court thus taking time off the shot clock.
- Crash the offensive glass, especially with Kendrick Perkins hurting.
- Gasol and Odom must stay aggressive
Boston Celtics:
- Stay focused and not think the Lakers will fold.
- Apply tremendous pressure on Kobe
- Defensive rebounding and getting to loose balls.
- Play off Garnett in the post.
- Stick with House and Posey to negate Kobe’s scrambling help defense off of Rondo.
Prediction
History says teams don’t come back from 3-1 deficits, but Kobe is a fighter and the Celtics will find out this game will be the most difficult to close. I believe if they get an early lead and put tremendous pressure on those struggling role players, they will win. The key for the Celtics is that they have two players in Posey and Cassell that understand Finals’ closing games and that will be the difference. The Celtics are the better team and they should end the series in five games.
Marco Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 5:34 pm
Wow, i feared the worst when Boston lost a game against Atlanta in the 1st round, let alone 3!!!
Now we are 1 win away from becoming NBA (world) champions.
I know its not over yet, but I just want to say that Pierce deserves finals MVP. For the last decade he has been known as a ‘good’ player, but this year, especially the playoffs, he has been the only player performing every night.
The formula is simple. If ‘The Truth’ plays well Celtics win.
Give him that MVP and the respect that goes along with it!
Cman Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 6:01 pm
Eddie:
Interesting bit on the roller coaster. I have really enjoyed your thoughts throughout this series — keep it up! Also, while other sports pundits are starting to jump on the Celtics bandwagon, you were there from the start. Maybe the writers at ESPN and SI can learn a thing or two from you?
Lupe Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 6:09 pm
I’m glad the Celtics have found themselves again. They created so much doubt within the first two rounds with their Jekyl/Hyde act that it was expected of them to fall to L.A. in the eye of the public(myself included, picked L.A. to win 4-2, though my finals prediction was meant as a jinx x:) ). Detroit was the perfect kick in the *ss, and they are running on all cylinders now. Hopefully, they continue to play marvelously on the defensive end, and Garnett gets a ring.
Also, apparently Paul Pierce is a prophet; he said he’d become known as a good defender by the end of the year(he joked that he’d make the all-defensive team). He did a great job on limiting Kobe’s effectiveness in the 2nd half last night. But in regards to great players, they always bounce back so I expect Kobe to strike with a vengeance in Game 5 for the win???
Matt Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 6:20 pm
Eddie-
I still can’t figure out why I hate Kobe and why I didn’t hate MJ, being a Phoenix Suns fan. Both are great players, one beat us for the title and the other is on our biggest rival. I think I’ve decided that why Michael might have been an a-hole to his teammates, he didn’t come off as a whiny little b*tch through the media. Kobe walked off the court with time left last night pouting and lost his mind a little bit in the post game press conference. I’ve tried to buy that he is being a good teammate but he reverted back to his old act last night.
I don’t care what anyone says, he is not even in the conversation for best player ever. I would put Bird, Magic, and even Isiah ahead of Kobe when it comes to the great players in the game.
John Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 6:24 pm
Love your blogs, keep up the good work!!!
kg Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 7:10 pm
nice blog eddie…
hopefully my idol gets a ring!!!
garry Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 7:48 pm
That link to your Youtube video was classic, i loved it!
Eddie! Eddie! Eddie!
The comments below it were great as well - apparently they love you like a God in Greece?
g
p.s. I’m a Celtics fan and was so annoyed by KG for the first 3 quarters. He’d get the ball in the post and instead of going strong would take one dribble and pass it up! He only went strong to the hoop from the post up a few times, mostly he went with the jumper. But his defense and rebounding and general presence were fine.
And is it just me or does Vladimir Radmonovic take the dumbest foulest EVER!!?!?!?! He makes a few decent plays but man if I were a Lakers fan I’d be dreaming of a good package trade. (lakers bench for
Oh one last thing, props to Ray Allen for shaking Sasha V out of his shoes at the end, the poor kid was about in tears while they huddled for the last time out. I do like Sasha V though, he’s got heart.
jeffrey soriano Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 8:25 pm
the lakers need to be more focus and aggressive in defense and make a good shot selection on offense. try to comeback lakers!
Michael Bennett Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 9:05 pm
Why hasn’t anyone said that maybe, just maybe Kobe Bryant isn’t as good as everyone makes him out to be? He’s a fantastic player, and he’s had some great games. But, the Finals is a microscope - it shows you the a lot about a player.
Last year, it showed the LeBron’s jump shot was suspect, and he had a horrible supporting cast.
This year, it’s showing that a GM can assemble a veteran All-Star team and win a title (yes, I’m giving it to the Celtics) AND, most importantly, it’s showing that Kobe Bryant isn’t the best player in the league. It’s showing all of his weaknesses:
- He’s not a team player and never will be for an entire season
- His jump shot isn’t as great as people think
- He can’t get to the rim as easy as he’d like, and as easy as his team needs him to
- His skills disappear in a tough series
- He’s tired when his team goes deep into the Playoffs
- He’s not a leader
- He’s not a smart on-the-court player who can adjust to every game
He’s just not as good as what people like to think. I like him a lot. I think he’s great. But, I don’t think he’s the best in the game. I think LeBron is. And, I’ve said that for the last four years (since LeBron’s 27, 7, 7 season).
I think part of Kobe’s problem is not his problem at all. It’s the fans. Everyone likes to call him the next Jordan, or better than Jordan. That’s a tough comparison. Jordan was/is the best EVER. It’s not something easy to live up to. So, like I’ve said all along, Kobe’s a very gifted athlete who’s an incredible player. He’s a top 5 guy in the league. But, he’s not the best in the game. If he was, the Lakers would be up 3 game to 1.
Michael Bennett Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 9:09 pm
TOP 5 PLAYERS IN THE LEAGUE (WHEN 100% HEALTHY)
5) Tim Duncan
4) Chris Paul
3) Kobe Bryant
2) Dwyane Wade
1) LeBron James
eddie Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 9:54 pm
It will be interesting if the Celtics close this out. that all my bloggers who killed me on my preview article to this series will visit me an
“SAY IM SORRY EDDIE”
Jacob Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 10:07 pm
haha eddie im with you all the way i picked celtics in 6 but i guess i gave the lakers too much credit. finese teams never win.
also dwayne wade is not a top 5 player in the league. Im sure people would rather have the likes of a dwight howard or amare stoudimare to build a team.
so my question for tonight is : Where are all the laker fans blaming the rims (game one), the refs (game two), game three must have been how all the games should have been, and kobe/phil (game four)… ever think the lakers just aren’t that deep?
anyway its sad that their are more sport coats then jerseys at an nba finals game in LA. At least boston celebs wear jerseys (thanks donny walberg)
Dame Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 10:18 pm
Its over, the only way the Lakers win sunday is if Crawford or any other NBA company men are refs. It sure seemed funny to me Phil Jackson cried after game 2, then poof all a sudden the man who blew the call(game 4 LA-SAN Brent Barry) is the ref next game. This series should already be over. The celts have beat the lakers 5 out 6 this year. Celtics by 10 on sunday, if i dont see crawford. Kobe with 40 tho.
DOUG CHRISTIE Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 10:24 pm
‘History says teams don’t come back from 3-1 deficits, but Kobe is a fighter” — Eddie Johnson
Oh please…
Can we stop with the ‘Kobe is holier than thou’ propaganda? Kobe is the same “fighter”, the same “unstoppable scorer”, the same “best player in the game” that played in game 4 and went 6-19 in shooting and couldn’t prevent the collapse of a 24pt lead that THE LAKERS (and not Kobe) helped build.
And to think that Kobe and the media went and threw his team under the bus after they helped him get to the Finals, a game one win (which they held the Cs to 81pts), and the biggest lead in the first quarter in Finals history.
Eddie Johnson, now is the time to look “back in your days” like you love to do and realize that no other player in the world is pampered like Kobe Bryant. He can do no wrong on the basketball court.
DOUG CHRISTIE Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 10:35 pm
Jacob Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 10:07 pm
also dwayne wade is not a top 5 player in the league. Im sure people would rather have the likes of a dwight howard or amare stoudimare to build a team.
========================
Wade is not a top 5 player? And who determines that: you? Or the grind of the regular season, the NBA playoffs, and hoisting the Larry O’Brien trophy + Finals MVP? If Wade is not a top 5 player in your eyes, then you’re just lacking any understanding of what makes a player great.
You’re a clown, Jacob.
mike Said,
June 13, 2008 @ 11:35 pm
when are people going to realize this laker team has overachieved and its really not that good..there just playing well..they remind me of the colorado rockies last year…no one thought they would do what they did…now look at them…im not saying the lakers are this bad..but come on people..get real…2 months ago..laker fans wouldnt say there the best team in the league..there really a man show..the whole team is inconsistent..sasha is terrible..lucky game 3 he had..now can SOMEONE PLEASE GIVE THE CELTICS CREDIT FOR STOPPING KOBE..THEYVE PLAYED 6 TIMES THIS YEAR AND THEY’VE DONE A GREAT JOB..BETTER THAN ANY OTHER TEAM AND HES SHOOTING WAY UNDER 40% AGAINST THEM..SO IS IT JUST KOBE HAD A BAD GAME FOR 6 GAMES OR IS IT THE DEFENSE..GET REAL PEOPLE..DONT GET ME WRONG..KOBE IS ONE OF THE BEST PLAYERS IN THE LEAGUE IF NOT THE BEST..BUT PLEASE GIVE CREDIT TO THE CELTICS…AND IF THE CELTICS HOLD ON..RAY ALLEN DESERVES MVP..I DONT CARE THAT PIERCE HAS BEEN THERE FOR 10 YEARS AND DID A GOOD JOB ON KOBE IN GAME 4..ALLEN HAS BEEN THE ONLY CONSISTENT PLAYER ON EITHER TEAM THIS SERIES HANDS DOWN!! I LIVE IN ORANGE COUNTY AND LET ME TELL YOU SOMETHING ABOUT LAKER FANS..THEY ARE THE WORST SPORTS FANS IN ALL OF SPORTS,ALWAYS FULL OF EXCUSES AND ONLY CARE ABOUT THE TEAM IF THERE IN THE FINALS..ANYONE WHO THINKS SASHA IS A GOOD PLAYER IS A MORON..FISHER IS WASHED UP.ODOM IS HIGH AND PAU IS WEAK..THATS HOW YOU SUM UP THIS LAKER TEAM PLAIN AND SIMPLE
hero character game Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 1:51 am
[...] on coaches?? faces and induces players to leave their skin and act out of character in anger. …http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/johnson/2008/06/13/thoughts-on-game-4/DVD: Poor Boy’s Game RainbowNetwork.comReleased from prison after serving ten years for a violent [...]
ericktmd Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 2:18 am
eddie i was one who doubted your prediction and im about ready to give you one big sorry but hey its not over till the fat lady sings. dont worry when its over i will post my apoligies. lol. i have a feeling this can go 7 games if only some of the lakers besides turiaf and kobe get a little physical. i sure hope you dont share the same sentiments of mr bennet regarding kobe. the guy is phenomenal. jordan is still the best but kobe is right there with mike. i dont really mind if the celts win, doc, kg, ray and pierce are class acts and they deserve to win a title. if we dont win this year we sure can look forward to the next years cheers ya all
Tasos Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 3:25 am
eddie it’s strange you always predict the winner do you have any relation to Tim Donaghy. Allen deserves the credit he is the true mvp of the finals. It is stupid to talk about kobe he is better in many thinks than lebron and everyone else in the league he is no Jordan and there should be no comparisons but beats easilly everyone else today. I agree that Garnett doesn’t play to his potential to many jump shots he has to be in the post at every offense maybe playing small forced him to get there, he has to play like hakeem did he has the tools but he doesn’t play. Do you read about your former team olympiakos? you made a great impression here you are a legend among the fans here in Greece.
K-mart Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 7:35 am
People are always underrating kobe or overrating him, first of all no one will ever be better then Jordan, he is and always will be the best player to ever play the game, secondly kobe is the best player in the nba right now. I know its tough to compare jordan and kobe due to fact that they played in diffrent eras and the game has changed alot since the 90´s not saying its a bad change or a good change im just saying that the nba today is diffrent then the 90´s nba. But the get to my point which is that kobe is maybe the only one who can be compared to jordan, ive watched 40 + full Jordan games and 40+ Kobe games and I can clearly see that kobe plays the game pretty similair to the way jordan did, i mean which other player then jordan or kobe can start making a layup on one side of the basket and hang past 3 defenders and lay it in on the other side? who can hit that jumpshot with the defender right in his face,hitting his elbow? Only jordan and kobe…
David Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 9:24 am
Michael Bennett, one of the things you keep omitting about Lebron is his acting talent. I love his commercials!! As far as personalities go between Kobe and Lebron, LBJ wins hands down.
All Kobe does is cry. He cried in 2003 when they lost to (forgive me) my Spurs. He cried last year during the finals because he wasn’t “happy” with the Lakers organization (and that grabbed most of the headlines). Now he’s gonna cry again, especially if he gets in the way of a pissed off Sasha elbow.
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:30 am
d wade averaged 16 ft attempts in that series for his ‘mvp’. he let his team crumble last year, great players dont let that happen nor do they sit out.
as for your kobe comment… i guess assists dont matter do they? of course you only point out what you want us to see and ignore the rest huh.
and i bet you think wade is better than kobe huh?
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:33 am
tasos - ray allen has played great but hes not the mvp… i think the mvp trophy should go for the whole body of the playoffs and because of that pierce should get it. hes been great (minus game 3) in the finals and won game 7 vs cleveland and game 6 vs detriot for us. no one else more deserving then pierce. on top of the fact that he stuck through the hard times here and was patient and now being rewarded. its only fitting that the captain is the mvp and i hope he then in turns gives the away to doc rivers who should have been coach of the year (i cant be mad at them for giving it to byron because hes always done a great job with maximizing the talent out of his team)
Harry Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:34 am
My $0.02
Game 5 will be a real test for Kobe. The Lakers cannot win unless it is a team effort. Kobe will be very tempted to take over the game and try to win it by himself. Can he get/all the rest of the team involved? I don’t think so. Cs win.
Ray Allen is disproving the “poor defender” tag. He has spent more time of Kobe than any other Celtic and has done a great job. While there is no player in the league that can shut down Kobe, Ray has kept him in check and made him work for everything he got. Somehow Ray has done this while not getting in foul trouble and making a strong statement for finals MVP. Ray Ray is the man!
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:35 am
ericktmd,
the problem wit the lakers getting physical over night is well, that just doesn’t happen. you cant learn to be physical and you cant learn to be a good defensive team over night.
another problem most of the lakers have with is they confuse the word physical and fouling. they are a bunch of hackers and foulers, not physical basketball players.
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:37 am
doug christie,
are you suggesting people wouldn’ t want howard over dwade? centers are more rare and hes the best at his position in the game, was drafted number one and was the dominating big man in the league since shaq has raised hell.
d wade isn’t even the top at his position.
you clown.
Michael Bennett Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 11:55 am
Dwyane Wade is the best SG in the league… when healthy. That’s the original tag I put on the list.
You can’t argue the numbers/stats. His are better than Kobe’s in every category when he’s healthy. And, the only season (besides his rookie year) that he was 100% healthy, his team had the best record in the East and they won the Finals - he was Finals MVP in what ESPN ranks as the single greatest Finals performance EVER.
Like LeBron, DWade gets his teammates involved on every play, even if he’s taking the shot - he spaces the floor properly so he always has the option of dishing. Kobe doesn’t do that. Kobe knows how to shoot. He doesn’t know how to pass AND shoot in the same game. LeBron and DWade do.
And, Dwight Howard has a long way to go before he’s THE best center in the league. He’s one of my favorite players, but he’s still very rough and he’s young. I think he will develop into a dominant player that wins in a couple of seasons. But, this year’s Playoffs exposed that if he’s double teamed and really pressured, he can struggle on the offensive end. I love the guy - LOVE watching him. But, he has a couple seasons, maybe next year, until he gets to the Tim Duncan level of playing well AND winning/going deep in the Playoffs.
This is LeBron and DWade’s NBA.
Kingsblade Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 1:03 pm
Jacob,
You can think the mvp SHOULD go for the entire playoffs all you want, but it does not change the fact that it is an award for the mvp of the FINALS, not for the playoffs.
I agree that there is certainly an argument to be made that the award should be changed to account for all of the playoffs, but as things sit today that is not the case and the trophy is for the mvp of the finals, not the playoffs.
You could even make an argument the Pierce was the mvp of the finals if you want, but to say that someone should get the award for the whole playoffs is simply not a legitimate argument unless they change the intention of the award itself.
Michael Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 1:21 pm
In game 1 the giant idiot known as Mark Jackson made the most appalling statement I have ever heard : “Kobe Bryant is now on the same level as Michael Jordan.” As if Jordan’s statical achievements weren’t enough to prove that statement both ridiculous and retarded, we have countless hours of archived video tape to show it as well. The icing on the cake is game 4. Would Jordan have EVER let that happen? No. He would have iced that game in a second, and not allow ANY defender to stop him from doing it. Kobe is a great player, but he has yet to give a great finals performance, and is yet to prove he can win a finals for his team. If you go back to the three titles Shaq won for the lakers, if you replace Kobe with Peirce at that time, you get the same three titles.
Michael Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 1:25 pm
And all this shit about Wade not being a top 5 player, give me a break.
Do ONE thing for me.
Go a head and look at all of Kobe’s averages in all of his finals appearances. You’ll see they add up to a mediocre role player.
Look at Wades.
Case closed. If you don’t believe, just look at the stats.
Jorge Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 2:33 pm
Game 4 should be enough for Pierce to be mvp…Allen is playing great too….
Also I think the injuries played a great part on the comeback….rivers finally did the rigth thing and spread the floor with posey and house…great game from river, but not sure it woulda happened if wasn´t for rondo and perkins injuries……
Michael Bennett Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 2:44 pm
Why isn’t Kevin Garnett in the race for Finals MVP in everyone’s mind? First of all, the Celtics wouldn’t be here without KG. But, more importantly, he’s played the best on both sides of the ball in the Finals - defense and offense - and he’s the anchor of the defense that shut down the Lakers in the 2nd half on Thursday, the major turning point of the series. His numbers aren’t bad either:
Kevin Garnett (Finals - 4 Games)
17.5 ppg, 12.5 rpg, 3.5 apg, 1.25 spg, 1.25 bpg
compared to…
Paul Pierce (Finals - 4 Games)
19 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 5 apg, 1 spg, 0.5 bpg (a HORRIBLE Game 3 - only 6 pts)
and
Ray Allen (Finals - 4 Games)
20 ppg, 6 rpg, 2.8 apg, 1.25 spg, 0.75 bpg
I think Kevin Garnett is the Finals MVP right now. Ray Allen would be a close 2nd, and Pierce is a close 3rd. It’s funny, because they’re all playing together as a team and sacrificing to win, which is the ultimate sign of a champ. But, if I had to pick an MVP, I’d pick KG. Or, let’s just give the MVP to the Big 3.
bryan Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 2:51 pm
micheal bennete have u seen any of my other post u make me feel like a bball genius lol ive been arguing that for yrs the only thing kobe does over lebron is he is a better scorer i agree but when ur flat out better across the board in everything else and u average just as many points and quietly are a better defender as its being shown this series there shouldnt be an argument i mean when they went heads up lebron exposed him locked him up and killed him on the other end 2 xs this year but he plays his cards so right lebron always says kobe is the best lol but when u look up lebrons number are better yr after yr and he usually has more wins if he doesnt get hurt they win 55 games is kobe still ur mvp ??cavs didnt have half there starters the whole yr ……see things 4 wat they are ppl the west and kobe bryant r over rated
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 4:13 pm
pts ast to rbs stls fg% ft% 3pt%
kobe 25 4.6 2.9 5.3 1.5 45.3 83.9 34
wade 23.9 6.5 3.6 4.8 1.75 48.1 77.4 25.8
i dont see how d wade is a clear cut favorite, kobe is a better shooter. hes done it alot longer, was never hurt, is an nba mvp, the way you guys are talking about him your sounding like hes garbage.
kingsblade,
i do think pierce should get it and will get and heres why…
pts rbs asts stls
pierce 19 4.5 5 1.0
allen 20 6 2.8 1.2
now those are probably are the stats most looked at by fans, when you look all are winable to shift either way depending game 5( and maybe 6-7) except for assists. When pierce has the ball in his hands i feel most comfortable because he can drive and have three beautiful options in 1. take it himself, 2. pass to kg in the post or 3. ray allen shoots.
this also doesn’t mention the great job defensivly that paul pierce is doing. this isn’t saying ray isn’t playing great d either becuase he is, but ray allen doesn’t play 48 minutes if he guards kobe the whole game.
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 4:35 pm
kobe has trouble scoring on bigger and stronger forwards/guards.
Michael Bennett Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 5:16 pm
Why does everyone think Kobe is such a great shooter? He shoots a career 45% FG. His best season was at just under 47% FG. DWade shoots better from the field, plain and simple. He’s a career 48% FG. DWade’s mid-range jumper is one of the best in the league, if not THE best. And, most importantly, DWade can pass and score in the same game.
I think he’s better. I know I’m in the minority on this one. Okay. Fine. I also think LeBron is better than Kobe. Again, most people think otherwise. Sometimes though, majority thinking isn’t correct. In fact, sometimes, it’s WAAAAAY off. For an example, look at America’s South before 1865.
eddie Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 6:26 pm
DOUG CHRISTIE
STOP HATING! Kobe is the best in the league—so live with it bro!
Jacob Said,
June 14, 2008 @ 6:53 pm
so i got kicked off celticsblog.com because someone made a thread saying how doc rivers didn’t coach his team to victory because if perkins never got hurt he wouldn’t have played small ball, so i shut him up in a not so nice way and they banned me because i am sick of the haters on doc, hes a great doc and even better person, eddie you should write a nice article about him with the contacts you have by playing against him and he loves the media, hes always been friendly so do up a story.
Kingsblade Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 12:38 am
Jacob,
I didn’t look at any stats whatsoever when responsing to your post, nor did I say that Pierce should not be mvp. I merely pointed out that you cannot pick a finals mvp based on the rest of the playoffs.
I would have no problems with any of the three of them being selected for finals mvp at this point. I am not even entirely sure which of them I would select right now, I would almost have to watch game tape to decide.
One question though…what does the fact that Allen would not have played the full 48 if he was guarding Kobe have to do with any of this? So what?
Mikel Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 2:21 am
One thing many are neglecting to mention is that LeBron had a very difficult series against Boston too, just like Kobe… he shot a 35.5 FG% and a 23.1 3pt%. He also averaged over 5 TO a game. Kobe so far is shooting a 43.2 FG% and 20% for 3 pointers and just over 3 TO per game. Whatever criticisms people have of Kobe in this series, you have to admit that leBron’s stats are even worse. And I can’t “prove” to anyone that Kobe’s midrange shot is better, but it sure looks that way to me. The only thing this series is really proving in my opinion is that great defense does in fact win championships– though it doesn’t necessarily win the interest of the fans. Ironically, few even on this blog are debating who plays the best team defense, but would rather engage in the old Kobe vs LeBron who’s-the-best-individual-player debate.
Jacob Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 8:51 am
more minutes equals more time to fill up the stat sheet lol. thats all and i knew your point bout the whole body of work.
michael bennett are you a celtics fan? because if the celtic fans got to vote paul pierce would be the mvp. the finals mvp cant have a stat like this … the celtics are 1-4 when ray allen scores more than 20.
d wade is a better shooter? thats laughable. he may be a better decision maker with his shots (remember d wade is the sg version of tony parker, all he does is drive to the hoop) kobe shoots better from 3pt and ft…but those dont make you a good shooter huh?
jeremy Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 10:35 am
The Lakers were a monumental second half meltdown away from tieing this series 2-2 and taking the drivers seat in this series. I just find it quite funny how many people on here are now bashing Kobe after the guy has basically, single-handedly guided the Lakers past Denver, Utah, and San Antonio into the Finals.
As much as Kobe can carry the Lakers, their success ultimately comes down to how effective Lamar Odom is. Throughout the playoffs, he has had a good game, seemingly, every other game. In the Finals, he has been just dreadful.
The Celtics copied what San Antonio used when after game 2 Oberto backed off Odom, forcing him to take the outside shot and had success doing so. Not only are the Celtics forcing Odom to beat them, they are double teaming off him.
Gasol is what he is. He;ll have dominant stretches, but he’s not a dominant player. He hasn’t been great, but his defense has been good and his rebounding has been as good as it’s been all playoffs. Odom has been terribly disappointing. He is the only guy other than Kobe, that the opposing team will almost never have a good defensive match for. Hopefully for the Lakers, he can wake up before this series is over.
Michael Bennett Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 10:55 am
Jacob - I’m not limited to being a Celtics fan. I’m an NBA fan. I like the Lakers, too. I also like the Knicks, I just didn’t like Isiah Thomas and some of their personnel. I prefer the Bulls and Cavs (because of the LeBron), but I pretty much like every team. This means I have no bias. (Well, a little :)) But, I try and look at the game as even handed as possible.
So, when looking at Kobe, I see a very great player. I see a player who, because he’s got a shoot first, shoot second, shoot third, and maybe pass fourth personality, he’s not as good of a teammate and winner. I always called him the best role SG ever. When he played with Shaq, and Shaq was king, the Lakers were nearly unstoppable. But, as soon as he wanted the spotlight, the Lakers crumbled… even with two other future HOFers. Why? Because he wasn’t being the role SG he should have been. By the way, Ray Allen in the Finals is being exactly that - a role SG. He’s playing at a very high level, high efficiency. Check out his FG attempts for proof.
DWade on the other hand is a leader/winner. When he is healthy, night in and night out he puts up unbelievable numbers while beating teams. When he won the championship with Shaq and had the best record in the East, it was HIS team,not Shaq’s, and Shaq was playing the role Center.
Look at Kobe on the USA team last summer. Because he wasn’t the star (many tried to make him the star or though he was, but he wasn’t), they tore threw teams. Why? Because he’s the best role SG ever. He’s just not good enough to be the spotlight, team leading/winning SG that MJ was. Sorry. It’s something I’ve said for years.
And, Mikel - I’ve been talking about Kevin Garnett for MVP… and his defense. Naturally, most discussions morph into Kobe vs. LeBron because it’s a hot topic. We don’t know who’s better. That’s why it’s always being argued. But, I’ve also talked about Garnett, and how I think he’s the Finals MVP, how he’s truly the most valuable player to their respective team - I even thought he should have been regular season MVP because of his immediate impact. He’s like a fast forward version of Tim Duncan AKA an exciting Tim Duncan.
I’m so Fing excited for tonight. Regardless of how many games this series has gone, it’s been amazing basketball.
Mikel Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 3:04 pm
It’s been funny to read complaints coming from L.A. writers and bloggers about all of the wealthy know-nothings who show up at games to cheer on a team that is composed of at least eight guys whose names they aren’t even familiar with. One actress, talking after the Laker win, referred to the good play of “the guy with the hair and the guy with the ears” (presumably Vujacic and Radmanovic)…
Jorge Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 4:29 pm
I disagree, I think the “guy with the ears” to be farmar!
Funny stuff……
Jacob Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 9:21 pm
so its kobes fault they lost the 04 finals to the pistons? not the fact that the pistons played better defense and played with more energy?
kobe is going to be 10th all time on the playoff scoring list.. at his young age of 28
Michael Bennett Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 11:10 pm
Kobe is turning 30 years old in August you bozo.
Doug Christie's Wife Said,
June 15, 2008 @ 11:26 pm
Doug I told you not to be coming up on Hoops Hype talking smack and acting the fool! Now get outside and mow the lawn!
Doug Christie's wife's cousin Said,
June 16, 2008 @ 3:27 am
Girl you so crazy! I tol’ you to keep a eye on that fool!
ray allen wife | Lasts information Said,
June 18, 2008 @ 1:32 am
[...] Thoughts on Game 4I told my wife at halftime that if the Celtics could hold the Lakers to 90 points, they would win the game. She looked at me like I was crazy, but I knew that the Celtics are the only team in the league other than San Antonio that could …HoopsHype.com NBA Blogs - Eddie Johnson - http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/johnson [...]
ray allen wife | Hottags Said,
June 18, 2008 @ 1:33 am
[...] Thoughts on Game 4I told my wife at halftime that if the Celtics could hold the Lakers to 90 points, they would win the game. She looked at me like I was crazy, but I knew that the Celtics are the only team in the league other than San Antonio that could …HoopsHype.com NBA Blogs - Eddie Johnson - http://blogs.hoopshype.com/blogs/johnson [...]