Marbury out of line
I don’t know how to react to the news of Stephon Marbury wanting to finish his career in Italy, only to say… Please start your career here in the United States before you leave.
I have said this before and I will again, Marbury is the most talented specimen at point guard in the NBA. When I heard that comment about Italy, it just reinforced my thoughts on Marbury and that is he thinks of himself first and everyone else second when he opens his mouth. What about paying the league and the Knicks back for making you wealthy beyond your dreams? What about leaving a legacy in your own country before you go to another? When you were growing up in Coney Island, what was your dream? I assume it was playing for the Knicks. That should be your focus and nothing else, because I bet bottom dollar if the Knicks go deep in the playoffs in the next few years, Italy will not even cross your lips.
Marbury is not alone in this assessment. I am growing extremely tired of superstars who commanded and got a huge chunk of the salary cap wanting to change teams or, in Marbury’s instance, looking forward to playing somewhere else. I wonder if they have realized the rainbow is not guaranteed to produce gold on the other end.
Stephon, your pot of gold is right there in New York. Now reward James Dolan and Isiah Thomas with a winning team because they have invested heavily in you. They surely do not want to hear about your future plans surrounded by your immediate thoughts on the Knicks.
I played in Europe and if you think they will accept a me-first attitude over there, please don’t go. I guarantee you will find out what a heated up coin feels like when it connects with your head. Or rocks being thrown at your house after a huge loss or subpar effort and your kids trying to figure out why.
Steph, you have no clue what pressure is until you go play in Greece and the fans seem like they are in your shirt and smoke fills the arena from either flares being shot across the stadium or cigarettes.
I loved my experience in Greece and I would not trade it for nothing in the world, but it was the most pressure-packed nine months I have ever encountered in my life. I would have liked the idea of you going there out of college for a year or two and then we might be seeing the Starbury we know you can be.
So my advice to you is to finish what you started in your own country before you start looking somewhere else.
Arthur Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:15 pm
Eddie bringing it!! Marbury is the poster boy for everything wrong in the NBA. He is not a bad guy or a bad player but too much money handed to guys to early convincing them that being great is not necessary. Good article Eddie.
sf Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:26 pm
for the most part, I agree with you, and for what it is worth, I am a stephon fan, a knicks fan.
i have a feeling though that Isiah must have told marbury that he won’t get another contract with the knicks. perhaps not in so many words.
that doesn’t excuse steph’s statements. he seems to talk without thinking. any good nba player is impulsive, but when you’re not on the court, it can get you into a lot of trouble, as many of your colleges can attest.
the real story is that the nba refs may be betting on games they officiate. i’ve often felt -for the past five years at least, if not more so when Jordan played- that the refs controlled the outcome of the game more than the fans realized. now it seems there may be justice after all.
Fire David Stern!
LincolnHighNyC Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:33 pm
Yeah Marbury is really going through some sort of issues mentally in life I think. Eddie got it right on point, most talented specimen at the pg position, but we’re still waiting to see all that come into a whole and see it first hand. We know the talent he has, but have waited 12 years for him to show it. He’s acting like he’ll be greated with open arms, how, when it’s hard enough for him to get that from his hometown now?
On another note, has anyone seen that interview he did where it seemed like Marbury was on something? Seriously, go check it out on youtube or something and see for yourself, the end of the interview got really, weird.
PR14 Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:35 pm
Eddie, i also think Marbury is the most talented point guard along with B-diddy in the league physically, he needs to be thankful for all the money his got from playing in the nba. Individually yes he deserves it, team wise hell no. if he goes to Italy it will be interesting. Marbury is another Athlete a la Tracy Macgrady that doesn’t run the court, full court wise. He doesn’t uses his speed, only his quickness in the backcourt.
Brian Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:36 pm
Why , Eddie? REmember he is getting old by day if he wants to finish his basketball career in Europe let him do it. He has done a lot in the NBA and the Knicks. Why is it that the UNited States doen’t win gold in world championship. Basketball is basketball no matter where you go. In the next two years who is going to look at him in the NBA.If Italy is where he wants to go let him. His NBA career will be done as soon is he reaches the age of 33. At that age he can finish his basketball career in ITALY>
Donovan Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:42 pm
Eddie,
First, Italy is not like Grecce.
Second, sorry to be unpolite, but you are/were like most of the americans players that play in europe that think that they are the center of the world and they have to teach us everything.
And third and last, if we throw rocks at the house of the player that play bad, in usa you can find sombody being killed for the same.
Please in the future don’t use the cliche to explain a experience that you have lived but you can’t understand.
Europe isn’t the Eiffel Tower, the Queen of England, Venice and the bull-fighters. Renew your mind.
PD: If Marbs go to Italy and wants to play for a top team he will be there just one month, if he want to play as he play in the NBA, he will have to find a team of the bottom of the table.
Cheers!
Steven A. Smith Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:48 pm
Marbury is washed up already and only getting older. In two years can we really expect anything out of him.
DL Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:50 pm
Eddie - your line about ’starting your career here first’ before moving overseas was genius! I think it’s possible that Marbury’s talent is overrated, that in fact he is performing to the best of his ability. Part of talent, beyond the physical, is the mental and social. Some guys can will their teammates to be more focused in what they do, ie: Jordan, Bird, Magic. Marbury doesn’t have that skill, and he also doesn’t have the same mental ability to get the most out of his talent like Tim Duncan or even, though he fades in the clutch, Dirk Novitzki. If Marbury chooses to leave the States for Europe, alright man, go on ahead and get it done. He’s a talent, but not a great talent that the NBA couldn’t easily replace. Shame to lose his shoe deal however; it’s the best thing he’s ever done.
Eddie Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 5:51 pm
Brian
i have no problem with him going to Italy or Russia. Did you read? i played in Europe, but i didn’t talk about it before my work was done here. How would you like an employee that you are paying top dollars too to openly discuss working somewhere else. give me a break!
Cliff Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 6:35 pm
I just wanted to stop by and refute Eddie’s statement of Marbury being the most talented specimen at point guard, I’m going with Baron Davis!!!
CLO Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 6:39 pm
Brian,
What exactly has Marbury done in the NBA? He’s always been a ME-FIRST player, has never been able to carry his team or make teammates better, and has never made it past the first round of the playoffs…when he actually made the playoffs that is. He has led teams into the lottery 6 times and had numerous altercations with teammates. This whole “Starbury Sneaker Movement” is more PR than anything else for him…trying desperately to fix that image. Too bad he always says something stupid to the media…his idiotic statement about being the best PG in the NBA basically sums up his entire career.
david Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 6:51 pm
Eddie,
What impressed Marbury was basically being a tourist (and with an unlimited budget). I also lived and worked in Europe (France), obviously not in basketball, and I loved it! A lot of people come back saying they want to go back and live. He’s lucky that he still has skills to do that, even though he really doesn’t need to work.
I equate all this as a way to draw attention to himself as his basketball sure ain’t. Kinda like Kobe wanting to take his ball and go home — smack in the middle of the finals.
Noah Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
“When I heard that comment about Italy, it just reinforced my thoughts on Marbury and that is he thinks of himself first and everyone else second when he opens his mouth.”
I think you’re giving Marbury a lot of credit in suggesting he thinks at all before he speaks.
Rashidi Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 7:45 pm
Finish what he started??? He has already led many teams to losing seasons and quick playoff exits. Why does he need to do more of this?
Marbury is a smart businessman who wants to spread his sneaker worldwide. He wouldn’t get more than the MLE from any NBA team when his contract is up, in fact. The market for 32 year old PGs who have only been selected to 2 all-star teams in 13 years is not that great.
Also, I don’t get why “analysts” continually butter up Marbury as one of the most talented PGs in the world, when obviously these people haven’t heard of Jason Kidd, Steve Nash, Gilbert Arenas, or Allen Iverson. Marbury is supposedly a “me-first player” who has NEVER had a season comparable to any of those players, two of whom are “me-first” players.
While we’re at it, can we cut the crap about Marbury being a me-first player? He hasn’t been since New Jersey, when the whole team around him sucked.
FGA per 40 mins
Crawford 16.1
Robinson 15.4
Frye 14.5
Curry 14.3
Marbury 13.9
Richardson 13.4
Marbury was only 5th on the team in shot rate.
Other PGs
Gilbert Arenas 21.0
Allen Iverson 19.0 (17.9 w/Den)
Baron Davis 18.6
Sam Cassell 17.8
Tony Parker 17.5
Maurice Williams 17.0
Mike Bibby 16.8
TJ Ford 16.1
Jamaal Tinsley 15.9
Jameer Nelson 15.0
Kirk Hinrich 14.9
Jason Terry 14.9
Chris Paul 14.8
Deron Williams 14.7
Steve Nash 14.5
That’s 15 starting PGs (i.e. half the league’s) who take more shots than Marbury. The PGs who took fewer shots than Marbury were notable pass-first players like Kidd, Andre Miller, and Jason Williams, all of whom were only taking one shot per 40 less than Marbury.
Other notable players
Carmelo Anthony 23.4
Kobe Bryant 22.4
Zach Randolph 21.2 (numbers will take huge hit on Knicks)
Willie Green 18.8
Adam Morrison 16.2
Anyway, the “me-first” label no longer applies to Marbury’s game. Criticizing his contract dealings is downright FOOLISH because team players become “me-first” when they are free agents. Jason Kidd is making what, 20 million this year?
Brian Laesch Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 7:57 pm
I didn’t agree with you at all at first–until I read the article, and started thinking about it from an employee-employer relationship standpoint. To the fan, like myself, I heard him say it and thought, “Wow, that’s pretty cool. He played in the NBA, and now he is going to enjoy the end of his career overseas.” It sounded great. I didn’t think about the conflict of interest. However, I still don’t really have much of a problem with it, if he is talking about when his contract expires. Of course, that could be because I’m a Bulls fan and don’t think the Knicks are really going anywhere anyway (or want them to, Isiah). If this was one of the Bulls saying this, I probably would feel the same way as you. Luckily, Bulls players have more integrity, and don’t say such outlandish things when addressing the media (excluding the occasional slip-up from a rookie in the Slam Dunk Challenge).
I guess, basically what I’m trying to say is, “Go Bulls. Keep up the good work, Marbury.”
jon Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 8:14 pm
stephon marbury is a exciting player who is a big boy, he can make decisions on his own with out spectatiors critizing evey thing he does, back in phonix, new jersey, minisota and even in the university of Georgia Tech he was looked at as a “me first” player but thats a label i feal hes droped over his stint in new york, he since there was alot of young fresh legs ready to step in the leauge and replace him so he changed his game to the new look nba.
tyrone Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 8:26 pm
uh, speaking of talent at the PG position, I can think of many more so than Marbury, Eddie. How bout Nash, Kidd, Paul, Davis at the PG slot??? Marbusy IS NOT the most talented at that position, is certainly not the best shooter, and most obviously is not the best at running a team. Cmon, the guy is a talented offensive player, but no more so than a lot of driving slashers and gunners in the league.
Ian W Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 8:26 pm
The specific idea of ending a career in Italy isn’t idiotic; it’s the tone-deaf delivery we’re all reacting to. Comparing yourself to David Beckham?
That’s par for Marbury lately. The other poster’s right — there’s a youtube video in which Steph appears to be drunk or worse, and lately he’s had more than his share of those. After the Zach Randolph deal, he made some pretty whacky comments about Randolph, finishing up with something about Randolph being a “youthier” person. Video of that is out there, too. Something’s up with Mr. Marbs.
Justin Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 9:24 pm
for a lack of a better term, he’s fucked… honestly in that interview he called his wife “my better half, my better HOE”.
I think talent wise, he is most defenitely top 3 which for me would be Baron Davis, Jason Kidd (in his prime), and Stephon Marbury. Steve Nash is incredible don’t get me wrong and as a Canadian, I love him to death but he is not the most talented although he does make THE MOST out of what he has.
tiks Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 9:26 pm
Btw, Beckham’s overrated too. Never won zilch. Lived off press hype and is finally hoping to win the big one in the….MLS! Talk about hype matching actual performance. Zidane for life!
SKY Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 9:41 pm
I think when Eddie means talented, he meant physically. Marbury is probably one of the strongest and faster guards in the NBA.
But I think you’d also have to consider the other talents players bring on to the table, such as leadership, work ethics, and ability to handle pressure.
Also, Rashidi, I think you would have to consider the tempo of each team when you are going to use FGA per 40 Min. If a team is going to run the shot clock down to single digits before firing up a shot, the overall FGA will be slightly lower. Of course if a team like the Warriors is going to throw up 30 threes per game, then everyone’s FGA would go up.
For instance, the Suns put up 6855 shots in total this year, which would be around 83.6 shots per game. But the Knicks on the other hand puts up 77.5 shots per game.
Eric Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 9:55 pm
But man greek fans really are crazy though, this year’s euroleague finals there was nearly a riot at the end of the game, despite the fact that their home team won!!!And they were screaming something nasty at the opposing team’s star player(Papalukas) for every second he was on the court, despite the fact he was Greek and one of the main reasons Greece managed to beat USA in the world championships.All i can say is, Greek fans are crazy, dunno about other euro countries though.
Jonas Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 10:01 pm
Marburys problem is that he just isn’t a very smart guy. And I don’t mean uneducated, I mean he’s maybe borderline retarded. You don’t have to listen to him speak for very long to realize that he’ s an absolute bufoon. I wouldn’t be suprised if he had an IQ of about 60.
Steph has had plenty of opporitunities to learn how to play the game correctly. He’s had a handful of great teachers, great coaches. He never learns a thing. He never has gotten better, 11 years and he’s still the same player. No improvement on the court, no improvement off the court.
It’s one of two things: A) He just absolutely refuses to listen - because he’s an idiot or B) He can’t comprehend - because he’s an idiot.
I’m a lifelong Knick fan and I was pissed when I heard of the trade bringing Steph to New York. I knew it was going to be a disaster, and it has been. Why does Isiah Thomas still have a job?
As a Knick fan I say - Why wait 3 years? Go to Italy now!! Everyteam you have ever played for immediately got better the day you left. EVERY team you have ever played for have been better off without you. The only thing good you can do for the Knicks franchise Steph? LEAVE!!! GO NOW!
Michael Bennett Said,
July 20, 2007 @ 10:02 pm
Before I read this Eddie article, I was excited because you’re back, and I love your work, Eddie. Then, I realized the topic was Stephon Marbury after reading a little and I immediately said to myself “WHO GIVES A #@%$?!?”
Eddie, Do you think that Stephon Marbury’s public comments about wanting to play in Italy after his NBA career will really hurt the Knicks? He’s never shown tact in his twelve years in the bigs. He’s a career underachiever who probably won’t see the Playoffs ever again. You’re (almost) right. Physically, he’s one of the more gifted players in the league. But, he’s thrown away all of his chances to be remember outside of New York because of his lack of effort. And to steal a line from the great Marlon Brando, he could have been a contender, he coulda been somebody. Too bad he turned out to be a bum.
The Knicks have so many problems when it comes to chemistry and winning that this might actually fire up players like Nate Robinson to steal Starbury’s starting job. Two people in the league get paid more than Stephon Marbury. And, I’ve always been for players getting as much as they can, when they can. It’s not a question of deserving the pay. The real fool here is Isiah Thomas, the architect of this horrible Knick team. If I was Spike Lee, I’d move to LA.
monte Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 12:25 am
Showbiz, has always been a talent, the question is, have we ever really seen his true potential, or is he simply hiding behind a huge pay-check. of course we’ve seen glimpses of his brilliance… But im almost 100% sure that if he could keep this brilliance consistant he can really make a name for himself, and even possibly lead the knicks deep into the playoffs. It his duty as a new yorker to payback the city that has given him so much. but isiah aint makin it easier for anyone, i think he really has to give marbury a real stab at being a leader (captain) and hopefully he can really shine in these last few years of his career.
Marvin Kwong Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 12:40 am
Eddie,
You definitely misunderstood Marbury’s intentions. I hope you looked not only into Berman’s article, but into the actual source, Marbury’s Blogs, before you started writing this article. Here’s a quote from Berman’s “Marbury Shocker: I’ll play in Italy:”
“Marbury, who said he wouldn’t want to play anywhere else, says he’s not sure if the Knicks would re-sign him at age 32 because of knee tendinitis.”
While it is still speculation whether he’ll play in Italy after his contract expires, there is no doubt that he loves New York. Let’s just call it realistic. We all know that at age 32, you’re welcome to call any PG old. That is an old age for a point guard, especially for someone with knee tendinitis. And have you seen this guy’s foot? It’s gross. That’s the sacrifice he’s given to New York.
It’s also realistic to think that Isiah might be looking elsewhere for a starting PG. You can’t blame him for not wanting to play anywhere else in the NBA. If the Knicks don’t want him, then he has every right to say no to other NBA teams. Playing in Italy instead of playing for another NBA team is actually a favor for New York. He won’t hurt us.
Here’s a quote from his blog:
“I love playing in New York more than anything and I am playing to win a championship in these next two seasons and go out on the highest note.”
You can blame Marbury for the Knicks’ losing seasons and he is a part of the blame. But he is not responsible for building this team. That’s Isiah’s job and if you tell me that Isiah has build a cohesive unit in the past, I would think you’re in heavy medication. Isiah has not surrounded Marbury with a winning team.
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:51 am
It is true that team pace can affect shots, however Marbury was only 5th on his team in shot rate. Baron Davis and Gilbert Arenas play in high tempo offenses however they also LED their teams in shot rate. The Knicks are hardly a slow deliberate team either.
Anyway, I took the liberty to actually go through Marbury’s career FGA/40
1997: 14.9
1998: 15.8
1999 w/Wolves: 18.3
1999 w/Nets: 18.7
2000: 18.2
2001: 19.9 (all-star, career high 23.9 ppg)
2002: 17.7
2003: 18.8 (all-star, all-nba 3rd team)
2004 w/Suns: 17.1
2004 w/Knicks: 16.9
2005: 15.9
2006: 14.1
2007: 13.8
Career: 16.8
The last two years have easily been career lows in shots for Marbury, he has shot the ball even less than when he was a rookie in Minnesota with Garnett and Googs.
It is notable that the two years Marbury was selected an all-star also happen to be the two years he took the most shots.
His shots have dropped every year since his most recent all-star selection, most of which was spent with the Knicks.
With the Nets and Suns (prime years) he was shooting 18-20 shots per 40 mins. With the Knicks he has been shooting 14-16 shots per 40. Which is in line with his T’Wolf numbers… which were before he was a great scorer.
Not really part of my analysis but I just thought I’d throw in Marbury’s playoff numbers. 4 playoff wins, 14 playoff losses, a 1.8 A/T ratio (compared to 2.5 in regular season), and shooting percentages of .365 (FG), .276 (3pt), and .725 (FT) that are all well down from normal. His best series was probably his first one (1997) where he put up 21.3 ppg (up from 15.8 in regular season) while at least shooting 40% from the field.
Bree Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:53 am
Eddie…you got to be kidding me on this one, Marbury is a unique talent but unfortunately an ill fit max dollar player….he would have been much better had he stayed with KG in Minny..but I digress, as Rishidi pointed out the shoot first point guard lable died years ago on the court for Marbury…only those analysts who mail in their commentary use that on him these days…and though Marbury is a strange bird sometimes, even controversal…he is not a train wreck like Kobe when he opens his mouth, he is simply honest….and to be frank I am tired of the agent controlled comments that come out now….does every player really mean it when they say ” I want to be with “what every team” for life…there is no where else I want to play…Eddie please, it was a breath of fresh air to hear the guy say that the knicks probably would not want him in two years when he had played for 13 seasons and had tendinitis in his knees…a breath of fresh air for him…a kid from the projects who says he wants to go global with his movement to make affordable sneakers more available and acceptable to not just americas kids but the worlds kids…..real or contrived for image or marketing purposes…it was a refreshing and positive thing to say and I appreciated hearing it. Eddie the next time you want to mail in your column please pick a better topic.
kris Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:57 am
there goes another superstar whose ego will not fit their home court…kobe, marbury, sprewell, and a lot more cry baby vets…
i say fire isaiah! all he does with the knick is injet it with superstars that have the attitude of degenerates! he always goes for talent and doestn know what his team needs…if I was Dolan I would court the logo, or maybe some retired point guard with a pass first mentality as manager!
Marvin Kwong Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:00 am
“What about paying the league and the Knicks back for making you wealthy beyond your dreams?”
“Now reward James Dolan and Isiah Thomas with a winning team because they have invested heavily in you.”
Just want to comment on this. Last season, if you’ve seen the games, Marbury showed tons of effort as a teammate. He defended well, he sacrificed his stats and deferred to Eddy Curry. That earned me his respect because I used to bash him for being selfish. And I really didn’t see that “me-first” mentality that you’re talking about last season.
Does this mean that Marbury owes the Knicks due to the losing seasons? He does right now. But even after his contract expires??? Please. He signed a contract that was offered to him and the teams should honor it. The best a player can do is his best. It’s up to the GM to surround that premiere player with the right players. Now, name me one Knick team under Isiah’s tenure that had the right chemistry to suit Stephon’s game. Does perennial loser Elton Brand (thank Sam Cassell for that one year he finally made the playoffs) owe his team after his contract is up as well? Or does this mindset only count for Marbury?
All I’m saying is, once Marbury’s contract is up, he’s free to go anywhere he chooses. And like I’ve said before, he mentioned that he wants to play in Italy because he’s not sure the Knicks would resign him at age 32 with knee tendinitis. He doesn’t owe the Knicks anything once he’s a free agent just like Elton Brand doesn’t owe the Clippers once his contract expires.
Eddie Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:07 am
Rashidi
You are missing the point. get out of the stat box. He is the most gifted player on the Knicks and if he plays like a point guard should the Knicks will improve. Stats don’t tell the story.
Eddie Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:08 am
I Meant specimen –not the best , but the best equipped.
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:21 am
CAREER
Allen Iverson: 22.0
Gilbert Arenas: 18.4
Sam Cassell: 16.8
Stephon Marbury: 16.8
Baron Davis: 16.4
Gary Payton: 15.8
Tony Parker: 15.3
Steve Francis: 15.3
Mike Bibby: 15.3
Kirk Hinrich: 14.4
Deron Williams: 14.3
Chris Paul: 14.0
Jason Kidd: 13.7
Steve Nash: 13.7
Sebastian Telfair: 13.0
Jamaal Tinsley: 12.9
Rafer Alston: 12.9
It’s very obvious that Steph is not the player he was 5-8 years ago.
Let’s be real here - his offensive game was not too different from that of Gary Payton. Payton in his heyday was taking the same amount of shots (mostly drives to the basket as his shot was flaky), and racked up assists (but wasn’t a truly great playmaker). There were three main differences that seperate these two players historically.
1. Gary was the best defensive guard of all-time. Steph is an average defender at best. Payton is a 9 time all-star, while Marbury is only a 2 time all-star, and this is the biggest reason why.
2. Gary played with Shawn Kemp and Detlef Schrempf. Steph played with Keith Van Horn, who was basically Schrempf lite.
3. Marbury forced a trade away from Kevin Garnett, whereas Shawn Kemp forced a trade away from Gary Payton. Marbury’s reputation was forever tarnished (especially since his teams did not have better success while KG was at least making the playoffs every year). Payton on the other hand ended up as the face of his franchise if only because he spent 90% of his career there.
Reggie A Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:23 am
Ming, Nowitzki, Duncan, Parker, Gasol,Diaw, Beckham, and Pele. These are all players who left their home nation and took there talents to another place. Were they so wrong to do so? I feel Marbury has the right and the freedom to do what he feels is best for himself. As I see the NBA of today we have official who cheat, Players are forced to wear uniforms on and off the court. They are constantly being judged by reporters and fan who don’t like them. Why can’t this young man move somewhere else to pursue his dream.
Whatever he decides to do with his life, I wish him well.
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:47 am
“You are missing the point. get out of the stat box. He is the most gifted player on the Knicks and if he plays like a point guard should the Knicks will improve. Stats don’t tell the story.”
That’s just it - YOU are missing the point. Marbury is already playing like a point guard. The Knicks biggest problem last year is that their defense was as tenacious as a wet paper bag. Non-Marbury players like Curry and Crawford also committed far too many turnovers. It is hardly Marbury’s fault that Curry leads the league in charges AND three second violations.
Unlike you Eddie, I actually caught most of the Knick games this year, so I actually KNOW what I’m talking about. One of the criticisms of Marbury was that he wasn’t shooting enough!
Marbury will never be able to run a team on par with Kidd, Nash, Miller, or Paul, that’s just not the type of player he is. However, if you think he is any worse at running a team than Kirk Hinrich or Mike Bibby, I feel for you. Why don’t you pick on a three time all-star like Gilbert Arenas or something?
Jonas Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 5:21 am
Rashidi
It’s not about the amount of shots taken, thats not why Stephanie sucks horribly. It’s all about the amount of time Steph has the ball in his hands. He pounds the ball. He dribbles dribbles dribbles the hell out of the shot clock. He is what NBA scouts call a “ball stopper.” There are a lot of “Ball stoppers” these days but Steph is the ultimate.
Steph kills the flow of the offense because he has the ball in his hands so much. Great PGs like Magic and John Stockton controlled the game because they moved the ball, they ball was never in thier possesion for very long. If the ball isn’t moving then the teammates arent moving, everyone winds up standing around watching, it’ll kill any offense. Horrible PGs like Steph and Iverson and Francis just dribble dribble dribble trying to create something for themselves, then they pass and expect teammatyes to bail them out with just a few ticks remaining on the shot clock.
Stephanie has had plenty of coaches who have tried to teach him how play the correct way. You are a PG move the damn ball, dribbling the ball is pointless, its gets you no where - this is Stephs problem. He doesn’t know how to Not pound the ball for 14 seconds. Haven’t even mentioning the fact that Steph is a horrible defender. Horrible offense, horrible defense, never learns never listens. Just can’t win with this guy- It’s impossible.
Stephanie is an AND 1 player. He belongs on the AND 1 tour. Along with all those other digenerate idiot clowns who will never learn to play the game correctly. Steph isn’t really good enough for the NBA, he won’t even be good in Italy.
Emo Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 5:22 am
Sup Eddie,
Mad respect on this article playa. Love your work.
Man straight up, I think the man is a chump. Yeah it’s cool to go play overseas, but for him to make a pubic announcement this early. Esspecially after making 20mill last season and another this season. No love.
Okay he is getting older but you just have to keep queit till the right time comes. Isiah doesnt need the stress.
Luka Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 5:24 am
It’s almost like Marbury is in purgatory. He’s putting up decent enough numbers to say that he’s worthy enough of returning, yet you always get the feeling that he isn’t always motivated, or doesn’t always want to get the team involved. He was claiming that NY was his home, he wanted his ashes sprinkled over the top of MSG, now is his chance. This Knicks team with a few minor additions on the bench, should be more than good enough to make a run in the playoffs next season. The Knicks are teetering on either being a pretty decent ball club, or totally self-destructing. On one hand you have a great low-post addition in Randolph, and some decent shooters on the wing with Crawford, and Richardson. Yet at the same time you have guys like Marbury, and Curry who demand the ball too much, and need to learn how to make their teammates better by not just scoring. Maybe they can reach a compromise. Sporadically play Marbury at the two guard, and let Nate Robinson run the point, slide Crawford in at SF, and go uptempo on most nights, but then maybe have Marbury slide in at PG on nights when they face more grind it out teams like the Spurs, where Marbury can penetrate into the lane and score, or dish it to teammates. I believe if they give Marbury some options and test some different styles of play out, they will have more success, and may potentially be a threat in the playoffs next year.
RM # 0 Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 7:31 am
I thought he wanted to go to Europe, after his contract was expired…..
Prince Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 7:59 am
I think Steph is always gonna be Damed if he does, and Damed if he doesn’t, i am a Steph fan and i want to thank Rashidi for the stats which are delightful to know but I argee with Jonas.
I did watch every knick game this season (some twice) and i noticed that he is stagnant on creating the offense, he will dribble then STOP, then look for someone to pass it to (Mostly Curry). THIS IS THE ONLY ISSUE WITH MARBURY’S GAME. His defense at times are damn near flawless (see when he Guarded Kobe and Ray allen) and his 3rd quarter take overs are quite pleasing.
If Marbury thinks he only has 2 years left here, then lets talk about making him better instead of bashing him like everyone else. BROOKLYN STAND UP!!!
Now let’s get th the REAL problem. What part of Marbury’s Game bug’s you?
Koso Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 8:02 am
Eddie so what if Marbury wants to go play in Europe when his contract is up. Stephon doesn’t owe Isiah or the Knicks anything but his 2 years left on his contract and his 100% effort for a championship.
Knicks don’t want someone who is thinking about leaving in two years why would they resign him
Yes playing overseas is different. You definitely can’t have the me first attitude.
Patrick Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 8:36 am
first of all, I am a big Marbury Fan, every talks about he is overrated. Can anyone tell me what other pg in his era average 20 pts and 8 assists… didn’t think so. Also he said after his contract expires which means he is think of his current contract and looks forward to playing it out. if he didn’t he would just retire right. he knows that once that final year he is going to be trade as bait for cap relief or just not offered another another contract from the knicks and he said he wants to retire a knick or die a knick so he knows he still has a few years still left in him so why not play them out in italy since he knows he may not get another contract with the knicks, their worried about that knee, and he doesn’t want to play for another team nba team.
SKY Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 8:59 am
Yeah, we really need a stats for how long a player dominates the ball.
For instance Marion can produce 20-9 having the ball on his hands for like less than 3 minutes in one game, whereas someone like Iverson or Crawford has to have the ball in their hands for 15-20 minutes in one game to score 30 - in addition to being less efficient as well.
In addition, guys like Nash have the ball on their hands for a big portion of the game, but what they bring to the table is not written on the statbox. For example, Nash might execute a perfect pick and roll pass to Diaw, and then Diaw passes up the shot and throws it to Raja Bell on the perimeter. Another instance could be Nash passing it to Raja, who is opened, to a wide opened Marion for a dunk as the defender runs towards Bell.
So really, I think it’s very tough to use stats as a measuring stick because they only show small aspects of the player’s game.
Pop Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 9:10 am
So what if Marbury wants to live in Italy?
chris Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 10:26 am
Donovan, the point that Eddie was making was not to trash Europe, or any other countries in that vicinity. He was only sharing his experience, in a specific part outside of Italy to offer the importance of PERSPECTIVE. Despite what he experienced in Greece, he’s trying to show Marbury that it won’t be peaches and cream in Italy. Fans will be Fans. Sometimes, they may be more vitriolic than others. I’m not well versed in the Euro leagues, but I’m sure they won’t be just playing in Italy. The team will probably travel, in areas that may not be as welcoming as home court. It’s well documented that many games provide less security than the NBA. Darko Milicic and Nenad have already stated the dangers of playing in certain areas. Just look at some soccer matches that occur in the last two years and you’ll see that fan behavior can be over the top. In as much as “americans” have a holier than thou attitude, let’s also be a little arbitrary. Many American players in Europe aren’t a me first type. Sure there’s a lot of Americans that are, but you have some quality, good players playing overseas who are just trying to make a living. Sometimes, it’s a last resort for them, after being cut from the NBA or being undrafted. Donovan, as far as calling out Eddie on creating “European” stereotypes, ie Eiffel Tower, he never once mentioned any. He spoke about a specific part, a real genuine experience playing in Greece. I hate to call anyone out, but if there’s a person guilty of stereotyping, it’s you. Americans can be humble, generous and friendly. Even basketball players.
Mr.European Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 11:05 am
Thats’ a very good article, Eddie. of course, if we take it to consideration as an article for commenting.
your article arised so many comments from my side that I could write another article and claim it for your judgement (and comments). Maybe I will write it. some day. for today it’s enough to say:
who starts talking about patriotism and “leaving legacy for your own country”? Eddie, be so kind, and cast your glance at the NBA policy. what happens with european players, coming to play in the strongest league in the world? what happens, before each championship (world bball champ., Olympics, European champ. etc.)? show me any single NBA club with a positive attitude towards the european players, that want to play for their countries? for the countries, where they have been brought up, where they learned to play basketball (like the US impacted on Marbury) and the countries, that are always in the players’ hearts? none of the NBA teams want to let the players simply go and play. I was shocked this year, when the Nuggets had no complaints about Kleiza’s wish to play for Lithuania. that could be an exception from the rule. maybe only Dirk never confronts the Mavs about the same issue, ‘cuz everybody knows: Nowitzki is a German and he will play for his country in, literally, whatever cost (he pays the insurance himself whenever he plays for Germany).
so my question is: do you, Eddie, feel like having a moral right to critisize Marabury for a wish to leave his country for some other, when all the americans do, is forbidding the players to play for their national teams?
in addition… when you tried to change Steph’s mind by telling “terrible” things about european fans.. take a look at your article once more: isn’t it what all the sportsmen are up for? for having crazy fans, for whom you are like a god, something to worship, something to respect and something to idealize?
on the whole, you article is extremely subjective, because you haven’t even proposed any info of WHY Marbury wants to move to europe. maybe it’s not all about the money? in europe nobody would pay as much as NBA does.
P.S. this is not a comment to defend Marbury. I simply was angered by the attempt to show patriotic feelings, forgetting about your own policy.
that’s all.
P.P.S. an answer from Eddie would be greately appreciated
Outstanding Article... Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 11:09 am
I couldn’t have said it better myself Eddie Johnson…
I have always been waiting for Stephon Marbury to finally live up to his immense talent, yet he always discovers a way to disappoint everyone.
Kingsblade Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 11:24 am
A lot of people keep saying things like:
“So what if he wants to go after his contract expires.”
“He doesn’t owe the Knicks anything after his contract is up.”
“So what if he wants to go to Italy.”
You people are completely missing the point. What he owes the Knicks is respect now while he is employed by them to the tune of very large amounts of money. It isn’t acceptable for him to say that he wants to go play for Detroit or Chicago when his contract expires, so why would it be ok to say he wants to play for a team in Italy?
No matter who you work for, you owe your employee your loyalty for at least as long as you work there. More so I would think when part of your job is public relations for your employer. If anyone thinks that PR is not part of the job then why do high profile rookies get training for exactly that? I am sure that Eddie can back this statement up 100%
Bree Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 12:58 pm
Eddie…given all the detailed responses on this Marbury article I would say the fans are way more qualified than you it seems to judge this player…your lack of analysis here and context is glaring…Marbury is a star player who because of personal choice and bad timing has taken the long way toward prominence as a team player….this is his year coming up, please watch him more closely and with less of a skewed eye toward the petty and the irrelevant…Marbury now defends (yeah that was him locking up Ray Allen in Seatle, that was him on Lebron…that was him on Kobe…that was him on the best perimeter player on the other team all last year), now passes first (yeah that was him helping Eddie Curry become the second best post player in the league, now is a better teammate (yeah that was him deferring all those last second shots to Crawford and Francis with no complaint), can still score with the best of them (ask Dallas who could stop him in D-town when he went for mega numbers), can shoot for average beyond the arc…this is his signature year coming up (remember Baron Davis was seen as washed up until this last playoffz now would you trade for him???)…this year with all the pieces Marbury has if he can’t get this team to the playoffs and compete…then throw him under the bus, until then lay off Starbury…he is loved more than he is hated … and be careful when you come at Knick Nation as we are due some prominent shine…. and will be checking all haters this up coming season…watch out for us in 2007-2008. Go New York Go New York Goooooo!!!!!
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:07 pm
“Horrible PGs like Steph and Iverson and Francis just dribble dribble dribble trying to create something for themselves, then they pass and expect teammatyes to bail them out with just a few ticks remaining on the shot clock.”
Let’s be clear, since you probably didn’t watch too much of the Knicks this year.
Steph is not the greatest PG in the world, but he does not dribble out the shot clock anymore than Hinrich or Bibby. He gets rid of the ball very early in the offense. The problem is that he rarely sees it again. Jamal Crawford is FAR more guilty of dribbling out the clock. Eddy Curry and Channing Frye are shoot first, shoot second players. Steve Francis and Nate Robinson also take more dribbles than Steph.
Having players that take too many dribbles is not a death knell to an offense, as we all know Steve Nash does his fair share of dribbling. The problem ONLY occurs when there is more than one player on the court who is doing it.
82games.com actually did some research on this last year, here’s the article.
http://www.82games.com/dribbles.htm
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:32 pm
http://www.82games.com/0607/0607NYK3.HTM
Won’t post the stats which would probably look ugly anyway, but here’s the link to them.
Right off the bat there’s two main things I see.
One, the Knicks went to the basket far more than their opponents, and also forcefed Curry in the post a bit, as they took lots of inside shots.
Two, the Knicks not only took fewer jumpers, but they converted them at a pathetic accuracy. It almost seems like they were driving out of necessity.
The biggest culprits on the poor jumper shooting?
Jamal Crawford, Channing Frye, and Jared Jeffries.
Robinson: .514 eFG% (69% of shots, 65% assisted)
Richardson: .488 eFG% (71% of shots, 83% assisted)
Crawford: .445 eFG% (78% of shots, 40% assisted)
Marbury: .434 eFG% (64% of shots, 47% assisted)
Francis: .429 eFG% (68% of shots, 48% assisted)
Rose: .393 eFG% (63% of shots, 84% assisted)
Frye: .388 eFG% (78% of shots, 73% assisted)
Collins: .323 eFG% (64% of shots, 44% assisted)
Lee: .289 eFG% (23% of shots, 77% assisted)
Jeffries: .269 (45% of shots, 79% assisted)
Curry: .243 eFG% (21% of shots, 48% assisted)
Balkman: .188 (26% of shots, 82% assisted)
The above data shows that Crawford and Frye took more jumpers than anyone on the team.
Not only did Crawford take the most jumpers, but he was also the least assisted of anyone on the team, indicating that a lot of them were off the dribble. He simply killed the team in this department especially when you look at what Q-Rich and Nate were doing. Marbury and Francis are not reputed shooters, yet even they put up respectable showings (and unlike Crawford, they were effective at going to the basket).
Frye hit a high percentage of these shots last year, however it seems last year he was a bit closer in, taking them from around 15 feet, while this year it seems a lot of his shots were from 18-20 feet, and his range isn’t that good.
Jeffries will need to develop 3pt range if he wants to start at SF in the NBA, but from the looks of it he can’t even hit the 18-20 footer with any consistency. 3rd worst jumper% on the team but the guys around him at least knew it wasn’t their offensive strength.
Stephen Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 1:42 pm
To Mr. Johnson and Everyone:
Its fair to critize Stephon because this is America and you have every right to do so. But before critizing him, reach and speak to him and let him give you his reasons for playing in Italy. A lot of those reasons are not basketball related. Alot of you have forgot that Stephon will be in his 14th NBA season when his contract is up. I know you guys say he needs to win in the NBA, but you have forgot its more than basketball to him now. Stephon is trying to reach out to people all over the world. People like Mr. Johnson and some of the fans on this board are missing the point. He is trying to get life after basketball together. While basketball is his first love he also realizes he can not continue to play forever. This man does not need media attention because he is in the media captial of the world. So he is going to get that attention anyway. That movement to Italy is about the Starbury movement. Its bigger than basketball. He is trying to connect with people and he wants to see everyone across the globe happy.
For those of you who have been to the autograph signings at Steve and Barry’s you have witnessed a man that talks with you, hugs you, signs any and everything you bring to him. You all are getting the man mixed up with the persona. Its easy to jump on a bandwagon and start bashing him. But realize what he is doing. How many other pro athletes will have the guts to do what he is doing?
To sum things up the move to Italy is about more than basketball. If you want to contact me, you have my email. The reason I know is because I speak with him everyday and I know his logic. He is not crazy or egotistical like some of you think. Its almost the T.O. Syndrome. What people hear and see from the media is how they think a person is. They dont know this man is on a 17 day tour going to 38 cities. He is away from his wife and children and is dying to see them. You guys dont see the aches he has from signing autographs all day long. Try signing 3+ autographs per person, for 100 people per store! Then you will understand.
I know I said a lot and bounced around. But I just wanted you to know this move to Italy is about more than basketball. I was not going to write at first but its just unfair to bash a man before you understand the logic. You would want to be heard before someone bashses you, right? Mr. Johnson you played in the NBA reach and get his number. Call him and talk to him. Then you will get the full understanding of why he is doing this.
By you playing in the NBA Mr. Johnson, you should know the ins and outs of the NBA and know its big business. So you should understand were he is coming from. Just try to reach and talk before you critize the move.
I expect some negative comments about how the Knicks are not winning and every team he left has gotten better. This is not about the Knicks and this is not about the NBA. This is about the Starbury Movement! I hope you guys understand and join the movement!
Also this man bleeds blue and orange. The only team he wants to play for in the NBA is the Knicks. So if you guys thinks he hates or dislikes the Knicks, you have it all wrong. Think of it like this, before he goes elsewhere to play in the NBA, he would go to Italy! That’s how much he loves the Knicks and the Knicks fans!
Thank you. Keep up the good work Mr. Johnson.
SLF
Rashidi Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:14 pm
Also, figure we should talk about shot clock statistics (same link as above).
Time elapsed on shot clock (% of shots taken during that time)
0-10 seconds (37%)
11-15 seconds (25%)
16-20 seconds (22%)
21-24 seconds (16%)
A look at your NBA Champion Spurs
0-10 seconds (33%)
11-15 seconds (25%)
16-20 seconds (25%)
21-24 seconds (16%)
Nothing too different. Both teams take the same amount of 11-15 and 21-24 shots. The Knicks take more quick shots while the Spurs take more 16-20 shots which come more in the flow of the offense.
These number can be decieving, and a deeper look shows the Knicks had an eFG of .399 with 3 seconds or less on the clock, while the Spurs had an eFG of .465 (all those 3pt shooters). It’s more than just the shooters for the Spurs though. The Knicks are only assisted on 54% of their shots with 3 seconds or less. The Spurs are assisted on 62% of those shots. The Nets are assisted on 72% of those shots (.461 eFG). Etcetera.
So now, let’s figure out which Knicks were
A. Shooting shots late in the clock
B. Shooting unassisted shots late in the clock
Collins: 24% (42% assisted, .264 eFG)
Richardson: 19% (59% assisted, .443 eFG)
Francis: 19% (41% assisted, .313 eFG)
Rose: 19% (67% assisted, .257 eFG)
Crawford: 17% (32% assisted!!!!!! .382 eFG)
Frye: 17% (62% assisted, .461 eFG)
Robinson: 16% (59% assisted, .401 eFG)
Jeffries: 16% (67% assisted, .379 eFG)
Marbury: 15% (46% assisted, .424 eFG)
Curry: 13% (59% assisted, .467 eFG)
Balkman: 13% (80% assisted, .286 eFG)
Lee: 10% (79% assisted, .475 eFG)
Marbury had the 4th least shots with the clock running down.
Crawford had BY FAR the most unassisted shots with the clock running down. Francis was second, and converted them with terrible accuracy.
Check out that dribbles link I posted above, and you’ll find that the highest percentage shots are those taken with zero dribbles (catch and shoot).
If Marbury is dishing it to guys at the end of the clock and they’re putting a jumper up, you can live with that shot (the problem would seem to lie in that they don’t have many players capable of actually hitting the shot).
HOWEVER, when a player is dribbling out the clock to take a bad shot, (like Crawford or Francis) how can that be faulted on Marbury?
All of this should show that Jamal Crawford is a much bigger problem for the Knicks than Steph.
(I suppose it should also show how ill-equipped Isiah is as a coach, and how desperate the Knicks are for legit shooters, not athletic SF/PFs who can’t shoot like Ariza, Jeffries, Lee, Balkman, and now Chandler).
J-Killer15 Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:19 pm
Forget Marbury and Baron Davis; Allen Iverson is the most talented PG in the league, and he’s the only one who fulfilled his potential(I like BD though).
chris Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 2:48 pm
Dear Mr. Europe,
I don’t understand why Eddie’s comments have to be taken with an “Us” vs. “Them” stance. We all know that Europe has dominated in international basketball for the last four years. This is something that Americans are very much aware of and are trying to rectify. But, to say or imply that there is an underlying conspiracy to prevent European NBA players from playing their own country, to better our chances of victory, is a stretch of the imagination. In fact, Stern has not been shy with encouraging a more globalized basketball. From Europe to China, to Africa, basketball has grown exponentially in the last ten years, partly due to NBA clinics but also through Stern’s efforts. In fact, he has even mentioned creating a sister league that would compete in Europe some day. If you want to direct your nationalistic angst, direct them to NBA owners. You see, a player is an investment, like a car, a house or a boat, except they can total up to tens and hundreds of millions of dollars. Furthermore, it’s not just the contract, but also the residuals: jersey sales, merchandise, tickets etc. When Pau Gasol played for Spain, he won the championships, broke his foot, and subsequently jeopardized a franchise. Because the Grizzlies became very bad at a short time, after being a playoff bound team, trades were made to improve them, in the absence of the team cornerstone. Battier was gone. Stromile Swift, a horrible player, was in to provide interior help. As the season progressed, Jerry West was fired. These were all a result of Pau Gasol’s injury in the World Basketball Tournament, compounding a bad situation into an unbearable nightmare for all involved parties. American players are not spared as well. Here’s a list of all NBA players who played in the World tournament: Chris Bosh, Dwyane Wade, Brad Miller, Chris Paul, Lamar Odom, Joe Johnson, Michael Redd, Antawn Jamison. Do you know what they all have in common with Pau Gasol? They missed a significant portion of the season with injuries, and they all played in the WBA. Basketball players are not machines. They need the offseason to relax their mind and body for the rigors of the NBA. Stern and the NBA do not understand this, contrary to what you believe. So, Mr. Europe, can you understand why owners don’t want their players to play for their country, whether it is here in the U.S., or other parts of the world? That they should honor their commitment to the team, and their contract?
Stu Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 3:36 pm
if he wants to play there so be it. why should he pay anyone back?? pro sports are a dog eat dog buisness, make your money and do what you want, if u want to play in italy do it up.
Martin Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 4:21 pm
Amen Eddie. Could not agree more.
Aaron Ray Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 6:06 pm
Personally, I think everyone needs to get off of Marbury’s back….so he hasn’t gone deep into the playoffs…..It’s a team sport, you can’t single handidly bring your team deep into the playoffs….Jordan couldn’t do it until Pippen and Rodman arrived so what makes you think that the Knicks not making it is Marbury’s fault. I’m not saying Marbury has always achieved what he should, but people Knock Marbury as if he isn’t a good player. He is still top 5 pg in the league, he can score at will, and when he needs to he could get you 20 assists, the Knicks now have a formidable roster and I think this season will show how good Marbury can be. Has everyone forgotten how well he played at the end of the season….from All-Star break on he was playing at an all-star even all NBA team level, but injuries brought the season to an early end which I don’t blame him for one bit. Him wanting to go to Italy is not so much about him, but about bringing Starbury shoes across the globe. If his contract is up why should he have to stay in the United States? Also, his career would be extended if he went to Italy.
Stu Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 6:36 pm
marbury top 5 PG in the league?? c’mon
better PG’s off the top of my head without breaking a sweat…
1.nash
2.kidd
3.deron williams
4. chris paul
5. billups
6. arenas
7. tony parker
8. iverson
9. baron davis
10. t.j. ford (id rather have toronto’s backup calderon over marbury)
marbury is barely a top 5 PG in the east
Saleem Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 7:00 pm
Eddie while the opening line about starting your career is hilarious, I must take objection with one of your points.
You seem to suggest that Marbury owes some deeper obligation to the Knicks since he is a max player and hails from NY. I don’t agree. Marbury’s obligation to be the best player he can be is to himself and himself alone. Why should he be more obligated to the Knicks (or any team for that matter, when you consider that he was acquired via trade.) than any other employee/employer? The assumption that a salary negotiated in an open market contains some unspoken/undeclared obligation other than its stated value is class envy at it’s most basic level. So what if he dreamed of being a Knick as a kid from Coney Island? Guess what?As we get older our perspectives do and should change.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not advocating that he should jake it. And I’m not saying he has lived up to his current contract. But if, at the expiration of his current term, he wants to evaluate his life and career… I say more power to him. He’s a grown man. He’s earned the right to make his own decisions.
Now go out an buy a pair of his shoes! lol.
SKY Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 9:12 pm
Those are pretty in depth stats Rashidi.
Where do you manage to find them?
Aaron Pinchback Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 9:43 pm
I have no idea why anyone would be upset by what Steph said. Its not like he’s talking about walking out on the Knicks midseason. He’s not demanding a trade. He’s not even talking about going to another NBA team after his Knicks contract is up. once his contract expires his commitment to the Knicks is over. He can go where he pleases. If that means playing for the Knicks, another team in the NBA, the Italian league, or a rec league in Turkey, then so be it. We have no right to criticize the guy.
david Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 9:48 pm
to Stephen,
I agree with you about Stephon. When he was in San Antonio in 1999 as a member of the Suns during the play offs, he actually called our store inquiring about a certain brand of dress shoes. He was extremely modest and polite on the phone, and then sent someone in to get them (I think his name was Marlon, whom I saw at the game that night — Spurs lost in overtime).
WHo wouldn’t want to live in Italy? Read my earlier post — you can get caught up as a tourist in a place like that. I can’t tell you how many people come back from a trip to Europe claiming they watn to go live there. He is fortunate that he has the means. Why fault him for that?
And whatever with the stats !!
Eric L Said,
July 21, 2007 @ 11:30 pm
People, people, people. Can we please think before we respond? I just finished reading through all of these posts (ok, some I skimmed. I do have a life) and there are so many arguments made that I’m not quite sure where to start.
Marbury is a very talented basketball player but is not a true point guard. Personally, I would chalk it up to his childhood in New York. Playing streetball and becoming a playground legend is not exactly a great way to transition to the NBA. Sure some have done it (and well I might add) but the majority are me-first players because that is what is respected on the streets–flashy basketball.
Now it has been suggested by HoopsHype.com’s resident Stat Boy that Steph is not a me-first player and that his FGA per game or whatever stats were provided indicated that. Granted, he has made strides to change his image. However, he goes about it the wrong way. It is true that he does give the ball up early but it is rarely done to set up a teammate, rather to prove that he doesn’t dominate the ball. Then, once he’s relinquished control, he stands in the corner and looks as out of place as a freshman in a senior locker room. He doesn’t contribute anything to the team once he lets go of the ball, which true team players do. By the way, I saw where Stephon was below Steve Nash in FGA in one of your posts. Are you really asserting that Marbury is less selfish than the least selfish player in the NBA? Stats can be good, but please, learn to use them first.
And one more thing, Marbury was getting some love earlier for his “D” because he was guarding the other team’s best players. Well, that doesn’t mean he was playing good “D,” just that he was forced to guard those players because Jamal Crawford, Steve Francis, Nate Robinson, Mardy Collins and anybody else on that ragtag team couldn’t guard a cheese sandwich.
As for Marbury going overseas, I honestly don’t believe he will. Players say a lot of things and then some GM opens the checkbook and that all goes out the window (and a team will open the checkbook for Marbury when he hits the market).
As for playing overseas in general, it is much different than playing in the States. When the Pacers-Pistons melee broke out, the entire country was shocked yet no one was killed. In Europe, if a riot breaks out at a sporting match, is anyone surprised? No, not really. And people do get killed in those. And it was said that in Europe they will throw rocks at your house for a bad game while in the US, athletes will be killed for performing poorly. Now, to the best of my knowledge, I can’t think of a single time that an American athlete was killed for a bad game. Sent angry letters? Sure. Bad-mouthed on TV and in the streets? Absolutely. Booed? Why not. But killed? If that were the case, Dirk Nowitzki would have been killed about 9 times by my count for all his massive choke jobs.
Finally, about euro players not being let represend their countries? Look at it this way. If you were running a team and paying millions upon millions of dollars to a player, would you want them playing in summer games and possibly risking an injury that would hurt both them and possibly the future of the franchise? I didn’t think so. Pau Gasol is the perfect example. Memphis had high hopes last year until Gasol went down with a foot injury playing for Spain. Ten months from then, they were lottery bound. No team really wants their superstar players to play during the summer, Americans included. This has nothing to do with patriotism; this has to do with running an organization and doing what is in the best interest to the organization.
I hope I’ve made myself clear here. Let’s think before we post (although it is much more interesting when you don’t).
johan Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 1:24 am
rashidi! lay off the stats!
Rashidi Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 3:02 am
“rashidi! lay off the stats!”
I apologize for not being cattle that settles for generalizations made a decade ago with little proof to back them up.
“Those are pretty in depth stats Rashidi.
Where do you manage to find them?”
82games.com and Knickerblogger.net are essentials for any basketball fan.
SKY Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 3:19 am
Thanks Rashidi.
Johan, although most of the times stats alone can’t be used to determine what the player is like, more often than not statistics directly correlate to the results and what the player brings onto the table for the team.
Of course, in a more indepth discussion like this, analysis based on the games watched is usually required because how much someone dominates the ball isn’t normally recorded.
Simon Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 5:27 am
A lot of respondents to Eddie’s article have gotten ‘most talented’ confused with ‘best player.’ Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Chauncey Billups, et al, are all better point guards, but they arent necessarily more talented than Marbury. Of course, talent or promise means little when it isnt fulfilled, but it doesnt mean the talent isnt there. In a different life (or on a different planet?) Marbury wouldve averaged 20, 10, 5 and 3, and led his teams to success. Alas, for him, as a human being with frailties, it wasnt meant to be. Let him come to Europe and attempt to ’school us chumps’!
david Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 6:58 am
Rashisi,
What is the stat for team chemistry? These players do not play in vacuums.
uro55 Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 7:58 am
Whatever, this is the first thing “Starbury” has said in years that I respect.
Kyle Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 8:22 am
How is going to Europe selfish when he said that he wants to spread his Starbury line over there so that even those kids can get quality equipment/clothing at a very cheap price?
uro55 Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 8:34 am
How is going to Europe selfish when he said that he wants to spread his Starbury line over there so that even those kids can get quality equipment/clothing at a very cheap price?
Another good point.
Manos -7- Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 9:06 am
Eddie is right about Greece. There is a lot of pressure and fans are crazy.But this is part of the game and I love it as far as there is no violence inside or outside the courts. Italian league offers better conditions for the players but top Italian teams are not in such high level as Spanish,Greek or Russian teams that have dominated the Euroleague last years.And yes, anyone who is going to play in a top club, has to travel in really HOT arenas, especially in Greece,Turkey,Spain,Israel,Serbia or Croatia.
P.S. Eddie, Olympiakos’ fans never forget you!!! Thank you very much for all the great moments in Greece!You are my all-time favorite player!
craig beckerman Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 9:16 am
im not going to say steph has accomploshed much throughout his career to really be proud of but can i ask what gives you the right to question ANYONES career you were only traded 6 times yourself didnt do a whole lot as far as leading the kings in any direction noteworthy averaged well over 20 ppg every year your played and never averaged more then 2 or 3 assists granted its not the small forward or shooting guards role to lead there team in assists but i think this really shows how one dimensional you really were as far as my comments offending you you have the same right i do simply dont read my posts if they offend you
jay Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 9:53 am
I am a fan of Steph but the GTech Steph.Players sometimes say things that absolutly make no sense.The Knicks are not even a next level team what has he proved there?He should be thinking playoffs instead of Italy.
craig beckerman Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 10:04 am
of eddies first 6 years in sacramento they won over half of there games one year when he was traded to phoenix the first year they won 28 games before and after he was with the hornets there records were better eddies best years may have been as a phoenix sun and they retired walter davis number but not his when he was in seattle he may have had the best supporting cast of his career in indiana 95-96 they won 52 games and the next 39 you might think eddie had a role in this but the problem is he only averaged 7.7 and 5.3 ppg so obviously he wasnt the factor after averaging a dismal 4 ppg at the fine nba age of 39 he decided to not come back to the nba how does this relate to marbury glad you asked i apologize for his height he was born in life but its a very well documented case that the most important positions in basketball are the 1 and 5 not the 2 and 3 spots if marbury had put up eddies numbers everyone would have been very impressed by the fact that hes 6 foot 7 and averaged almost 8 assists per game for his career but instead lets knock the man for doing the same thing mr johnson has done stick around as long as possible make as much money as possible except theres two key big diffrences starbury at least has cared enough to try and give something back by trying to change the shoe world being laughed at while doing it by some yes i know about mr johnsons charitable contributions and how solid of a citizen he was but that was done alot quieter without as much of the pressure as starbury faces the other diffrence is height i have no doubt that if one compares the numbers we will very clearly see who has had the better career
craig beckerman Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 10:11 am
alot of people claim the nba was better back in the day but how many one dimensional tall ball hogs who can shoot do you see in the nba nowadays playing a significant role on there teams?
orrin Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 10:54 am
Maybe, it´s just that the pressure is too great to win and that in New York, as in anywhere else with a large tradition and an ever-present media, one can never really win unless they win a championship a couple times. If he has a winning season next season and makes it a couple rounds deep and then the following year loses in the first round, his fans will be dissapointed. if he makes the finals one year and doesn´t repeat on it, if he wins a championship and then doesn´t win another one, we´ll be dissapointed. Maybe, for some of these athletes it´s their own expectations they need to meet and not our own. I´m a Washington Wizards fan and i´m personally happy with my team for making the playoffs three seasons in a row. They haven´t won the eastern conference yet but they could have done worse.
Marbory has had some success in both New York and Pheonix. In New York he carried the team to the playoffs his first season here but then I view at as trigger-happy management´s fault and not his own. Why do we always hold the superstars so accountable?
http://sophomorecritic.blogspot.com/2007/05/nba-suffering-from-high-expectations.html
He did have one winnin
pat Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 10:57 am
The main point here is overseas basketball is “more intense and more fundamentally sound at the same time - even their fans”,. Nash, Dirk, Timmy, Parker, even Kobe grew up in Italy ! so many of the best players come from outside the U.S.A.
uro55 Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 11:09 am
Marbury is one of the best talents, but most over rated players EVER. Left MN, they got good. Left NJ they got good, left the Suns they got good. See a pattern here?
Anita Lawsuit Settlement Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 11:55 am
Great idea Steph, however to realize your dream
of “globalizing” the Starbury Phenomena you should
exercise your opt out clause NOW before it’s too
late !!!! We Knick fans will grundgingly accept the
tremendous….Uh….Loss this will cause the franchise.
Don’t keep the World waiting !!! Paris & Milan needs some
cheap shoes along side those overpriced boutiques !!!
:- (
morfi_aigaleo Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 2:22 pm
“Eddie,
First, Italy is not like Grecce.” by Donovan
Yes Donovan. Italy is not Greece. Italy has an awful league and with awful teams. You are right. It’s not like Greece
“Steph, you have no clue what pressure is until you go play in Greece and the fans seem like they are in your shirt and smoke fills the arena from either flares being shot across the stadium or cigarettes.”
Greece rocks !
Rashidi Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 2:59 pm
“Chris Paul, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Chauncey Billups, et al, are all better point guards, but they arent necessarily more talented than Marbury.”
Sometimes I feel like I might be the only basketball fan on the internet who believes “court vision” can be used in the same sentence as “talent”.
Because obviously, it is NEVER taken into consideration when people rattle off Marbury as the most talented guard in the league.
Being able to execute a flawless bouncepass at a ridiculous angle, that’s talent too. The way some people bring up Marbury’s talent you’d think he was a technical wizard on par with John Stockton.
Anyone who would contend that Marbury has more talent than Jason Kidd needs to check themself into a pysch ward. Maybe at age 19 when the guy freakin debuted, but not at age 29.
Anita Chucka Chuka Woo Woo Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 4:21 pm
Why is there any discussion ?
Marbury is the Best PG in the NBA !
He said so himself !!
jim 7 Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 4:44 pm
Eddie we love you. All Olympiakos fans wish you the best. We will never forget you.
Starbury is a great player but the way he’s playing the game is like a shooting guard, not a point guard. He’s a shooting guard trapped in a pointguard’s body.
Danoramo Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 5:06 pm
Who cares what Stephon does? He is a really great basketball player who has done some great things for the community and himself. He is my idol in one certain respect, he is (and will be) doing what he wants to do. In life, you can’t ask for much more than that. Financial independence is an important thing that most people strive toward and only some succeed. Basketball is a game, which he will probably only have the privalege of playing for 15 years or so, let the man do it where he wants, as long he does not infringe upon the rights of others or fail to fulfill signed agreements in regards to such.
In the true reality of this world, he owes nothing to the fans or the media, only to himself, his family and his organization(while under contract).
brooks Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 6:41 pm
Stephon Marbury is a very average NBA player, and for him to compare the hype he would bring to Italy to what Beckham has brought to LA is beyond crazy. He is a shoot first PG who cant shoot. To call him starbury is an injusice to a player who is mediocre at best. I am happy for him however that he got paid what he did, because that is more the bottom line of real life.
ComeNGetME Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 7:50 pm
Wow Eddie, thanks for finally saying what so many feel. Marburys done nothing in the league, yet thinks hes doing everyone, including those Italian teams, a favor by saying hes going over there in 2 years. He loves Italy? I dont doubt it. But i also think Marbury knows he’s not getting another max contract form any team in the NBA, least of all the Knicks, even if Isiah is still running things. Think he’ll play for the MLE? Doubt it. Hes f**kin Starbury! Starbury deserves the max!
Also, while its great that hes selling his sneakers so cheap so kids can afford them, this is also the second straight summer that hes doing an all-out cross country promotional tour in the summertime when most guys are working out. Think Steve Nash isnt working out? Thats how hes got 2 MVPs. Thats why Phoenix is playing for a championship. Marbury would rather go into training camp out of shape and rusty instead of spearheading voluntary workouts and setting an example for his younger teammates. You’d think the guy would show a bit more urgency with just 2 more NBA years left.
jon Said,
July 22, 2007 @ 10:49 pm
if marbury goes to italy it will change the game like becks is doing in america nd the game of soccer (football), the live off word of mouth and live good with out actully winning or playing up to the hype
Rashidi Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 12:03 am
“Marbury would rather go into training camp out of shape and rusty instead of spearheading voluntary workouts and setting an example for his younger teammates. You’d think the guy would show a bit more urgency with just 2 more NBA years left.”
Of course, lost in all of this is that MARBURY HAS BEEN WORKING OUT THIS SUMMER. You talk like he’s spending his summers any different than most players who do charity work, travel to other countries, enjoy their offseason, etc. You think Nash is working on his game when he’s filming betterbasketball training videos?
D Nice Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 12:09 am
Rashidi - do you have a blog? If so, please pass it along — I’d be Interested in checking it out.
Johan Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 5:38 am
starbury is a good player no doubt, he has tremendous talent. but i have yet to see a marbury-led team have as much success as whoever guards are out there. im not saying that deron williams is better than him for taking utah to the conf finals. bottom-line is, marbury wont fit in the european game. he should just collect his bucks here, retire in europe. maybe this is the year he will prove his detractors wrong and play team ball, know his role or whatever.
space Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 10:15 am
its a nice sentiment that marbury wants to live overseas.
but announcing that while in mid-contract to a club, and city that acquired you in hopes of success [—and your hometown no-less] is very low and a pretty tactless move. it took guts but who knows how many fans and supporters that you just may have lost in those 2 sentences.
he already has the career doubters to fight, and they have their legitimate reasons
—[phoenix suns upswing to playoffs after his departure]
—[new jersey nets upswing to playoffs and finals after his departure].
there needs to be a “how not to throw-fuel-on-the-fire 101″ class, and a “watch your mouth because-the-media-will-roast-you 303″: class for rookies of all sports.
marbury, you sit in the front row.
Anthony Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 11:37 am
What is wrong with Marbury going to Italy after his contract expires with the Knicks. From what I read, he isn’t looking to play until his commitment has been completed. Why is this guy always taking such heat? What type of trouble has he ever been in? I have never seen the me first attitude that everyone speaks of about Marbury.
I will be the first to admit that he has not maximized his talent, but that can be and should be said for 80 to 90 percent of those in the league. Eddie you know that there are very very few team first guys in the league. Everyone talks about the money a player makes as being the reason that these guys act a certain way. I don’t agree totally. Money makes you more of who you are. If you are a drunk without money, you will be a drunk with money.
The only difference is you will be able to buy better liquor. The problem with today’s athlete is that no one has ever told them no! This problem started way before they began to make millions of dollars. In my opinion Marbury, is a victim of his talent. The fact of the matter is, if he wasn’t so talented no one would care.
There in lies the problem with our society. Because a person can dribble/shoot/pass/rebound a basketball he is looked at much differently than the everyday man. Marbury may very well be a problem but so are so many of us!! This comes from a person that isn’t a Marbury fan but I am a fan of the game. I love everything that is and was great about the game.
Now days those intangibles, are for the most part absent from the game today.
Jason Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 1:11 pm
mabury said he would go to italy once his contract is up, only because he doughts that he will be resighned by the knicks, because of his knee tendernitis. your story sounds as if he was going to leave the knicks to play in italy.
Rashidi Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 3:11 pm
I briefly had a blog but gave up on it. I’m thinking about starting a new one though.
Stacy Padraig Said,
July 23, 2007 @ 3:34 pm
Too bad the Knicks can’t make Marbury’s Italian fantasy come true two years earlier. I’d take a canoli and slice of Sicilian for Marbury straight up. Sure, he bought some media goodwill with his $15 sneakers, but that hasn’t made him a better player on the court, one that plays all out, every minute of every game of every season. On the contrary, he’s still an inconsistant baller who’s just as likely to take a couple months off as he is to pump it up and play hard for a week. No team can win with Marbury at the helm. That’s obvious.
space Said,
July 24, 2007 @ 8:37 am
there’s nothing wrong with wanting to travel, explore new territory, etc. but mentioning that while in midcontract is a bit of a no-no. would you walk announce in your job’s lunch room that come december you’re going to quit, move to madagascar and live out your days there? a resounding NO. your coworkers would look at you like: moron. your bosses might fire you just to send a message.
it was bold but a personal statement. not smart.
Stefan Said,
July 24, 2007 @ 1:52 pm
OK…let’s get a few things straight. Marbury is and always has been one of the most talented guards in the league. But as a few have pointed out, unfulfilled talent isn’t worth much. I have to agree with the dude who said that he dribbles entirely too much and the other dude who said he can’t–or won’t–learn. I watched that interview and felt sad for him. Is he on drugs? Or is he just a bit dim-witted? I think it’s a bit of both. These sports talk shows need to figure out that a big-name player doesn’t always make a good interview.
I have to admit that I was a huge Marbury fan. That is, eight years ago, before I began to learn a thing or two about the game, before I started playing and studying and helping coach teens. Before I knew anything but what a fancy MJ dunk looked like, I thought Starbury was the shit. I’ve learned a bit and spent countless hours listening to more experienced players and coaches and I’ve come to understand that what Starbury is good at–one-on-one street ball–is not what the NBA or NCAA are all about, nor should they be. I’ve watched some of those AND1 games and they’re horrible; they take everything that’s fun and honourable out of the game. Marbury fits the bill. He belongs on the streetball court not quarterbacking an NBA team, an actual TEAM. I feel for the Knicks and their fans, ’cause as long as he’s at the helm, they won’t be going anywhere, Randolph or not.
Another thing that caught my attention was the comparisson with Gary Payton. One might argue that Stephon demanded a trade away from Garnett years back and that with the Sonics it was Kemp who asked to leave Payton. We can reverse the perspective and look at the situation through management’s eyes and see that the ‘Wolves let Marbury leave and kept Garnett, whereas the Sonics let Kemp go and held on to their PG, GP. Makes sense.
Last thing: all these suckers claiming that Marbury’s a soft touch with a heart of gold ’cause he wants to sell the cheap sneaks as a way to help “the little kids”…you’re all being played for saps. There isn’t an iota of sincerity in all this. It’s a business venture like all the rest. Anyone seriously involved in charity work will tell you that they don’t readily admit to helping or giving. They brag about it on TV. His attempt to build himself up as saviour of children is so weak and so transparent, I had to look away during one of his interviews. Blech! Cheap, low-blow marketting.
Mr. Johnson, your analysis is both astute and enlightening, thank you.
Starbury (ugh, his nickname says it all), despite your enormous talent and mad-rock handle, overall as a player and a human being, you’re kind of sad. Please do us all a favour and leave the NBA in 2010…poor Italy.
Eddie Said,
July 24, 2007 @ 6:31 pm
you guys have effectively taken an article and changed into a war against the countries.
Listen i said in the article and i will say it again. Starbury has as much talent as any guard in the league, but has not been able to bring it to the level we expect regardless of the circumstances.
the point of my article was this.
stay focused on the job at hand and not look forward to Italy when so many are depending on you in New York,especially when the Knicks have been a major disappointment. Keep your future thoughts about Italy to yourself. Unless you are Tim Duncan or Kobe Bryant. Why? those two have given the fans and organization what they crave. championships.
I don’t think Bill Gates had a problem with Paul Allen leaving Microsoft when he did. why? well because Microsoft was at the top. im sure he would have had a problem if Allen was announcing his move when the company was just starting to make a positive move.
My point about Europe is that it is tough regardless of where you play. i happened to play in Greece and loved it, but the pressure was immense and it will be worse for a more popular player like Marbury. I have seen great stars go over and fail because they don’t understand and think it will be a cake walk. I learned so much from Europe and we should see it with how USA Basketball has struggled.
lastly to Craig Beckerman who tried to give my pedigree, but for the sake of his argument conviently left out that i went to 4 Western Conference Championships and was a major player in each one. Also Craig i went to Europe during my NBA Career and came back to play 5 more seasons with the Pacers and Rockets. Sir Craig i was not stealing at the end. i played a major role on that Rocket team that made it to the conference Finals in 1997-98. Ii retired in 1999.
I get so confused with some of you people. where do you come from with your arguments? although i think Rashidi is overboard and way out of line with stats at least he tries and does research.
Bottom line is i tell it like it is. Stephon Marbury has an obligation to the Knicks and that’s it. the stuff he does off the court only came about because of the Wolves, Nets. Suns and Knicks. if it was not for those teams he could not have a company to sell inexpensive shoes. you talk about giving back to the community –first you have to do what you are preaching about. what about Starbury giving back to the KNICKS?
Hugh G Arse Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 12:24 am
Yo Eddie As A Knick fan I can unequivocally say that for the most part Knicks Fan really don’t care what starbury says & care even less if he bolted today.
Fact of the matter is Marbury will go down Knick lore in the mold of Charles Smith albeit with substantially less playoff games to (dis)prove his worth.
Don’t know if he’s even remotely useful in the developement of Collins .
Bon Voyage can’t get here fast enough.
Having said that , I have no problem with his max deal . If the owners are that Gullible it actually makes me feel smarter than these few trust fund billionaires.
In conclusion , Stephon never was & never will be the Messiah on any continent .
Arrivederci
david Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 12:42 am
The Knicks need a LOT more than Starbury to take them to the promised land. Eddie, I know you’re a big Isiah fan, and I can almost agree with you as a player. But as a GM / Coach ?? C’mon. He got out of Stevie Franchises contract only to tie himself down an extra 2 years with Zacko (read Tommy Beer’s article in Hoopsworld).
Cut Starbury some slack — there’s a lot of guys with his level of talent that never got a ring — Barkley, Ewing, Malone, Stockton, even the Shaqless Kobe.
Michael Bennett Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 1:23 am
Although I think you’re on the right side of this story, Eddie, I disagree with the free pass you give to Kobe Bryant. Or, Tim Duncan, for that matter. First, Tim Duncan would never do what Marbury did… or what Kobe did. I don’t winning championships allows you to air your grievances the way Kobe has. So, I think you’re off when you praise Kobe for his outspoken messages about the Lakers, and condemn Marbury for doing something similar. I said “similar”, not the same.
Second, Marbury was out of line, but he’s given the Knicks what they paid for. They paid for a talented, underachieving PG that gives them 20 points and 8 assists a night. I’m sure Marbury wants to win. He’s just not going to. Like I said, it’s more Isiah’s fault for the team not winning then it is Marbury’s. Regardless, player’s pay rate doesn’t constitute team wins. If it did, every team would be in the Playoffs. The nature of today’s NBA is that players get paid truck loads of money regardless of team wins ei Joe Johnson, Zach Randolph, Michael Redd, Gerald Wallace…
Lastly, Marbury saying that he wants to play in Europe is the least of the Knicks worries. Signing Zach Randolph only adds (literal) weight to their front line. That’s it. His signing won’t translate to wins in a budding East. The Bulls, right now, are front runners, followed by the Pistons, Cavs, Toronto, a healthy Miami, New Jersey, Orlando, a rebuilt, refreshed Celtics, and a young and hungry Charlotte team. Isiah Thomas is the Knicks albatross. Until the organization realizes that, petty indifferences about Stephon Marbury’s view on his remaining pro days are inconsequential.
Eddie Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 2:08 am
arrggggggggggggg. i am not giving them a free pass Bennett. i am saying they could talk about their next career because they have brought championships which means the teams have justified their salary. Marbury saying he wants to pkay in Italy is a big worry. they want his head into this season not two seasons from now. they want to feel good about the largest payroll in the league and Marbury is the key player. Plus any Kobe comment you take offense because you don’t like him. did you like the way he worked over Lebron last Sunday. Did you also notice Lebron did not guard him on the last play, but Kobe guarded him.
David what are you drinking? what the heck are you talking about? who said anything about the Knicks and management? thats a whole different article. please read David. the article was about the timing of Marburys comments.
Eddie Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 2:10 am
David those guys you mentioned all made it to the finals and are hall of famers. dont dare put Marbury in their class yet.
Joey P. Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 8:38 am
Damn Eddie, tell it like it is!!! Chi-town finest, we love you Eddie!!!!
craig beckerman Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 9:16 am
if 4 ppg is a major contributor every player in the history of the nba has been a major contributor i like how you conviently left out the fact that the hornets were a better team before and after you just seems very strange for a player that thinks he was a major factor in 4 western Conference championships personally i think its because you were surrounded by the best talent of your life
david Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 10:32 am
Well said, Michael.
My point, Eddie, is that YOU keep saying that Marbury isn’t allowed to voice his desire to relocate (one day to Italy) BECAUSE he is not a winner. MY point is that it is not totally his fault — look at the management. You always come to Isiah’s defense. Do you really think the Knicks can be anything other than mediocre?
I did not put Marbury in the same class as those others. I agree, they are hall of famers. Eddie, you’ve been to Europe, saw how cool, charming, different it is…so Marbury comes back and says in a couple of years he would like to go play there. WHo cares? I’ve been overseas at least 50 times — on almost every return trip I thought to myself, wow, it would be great to move back to Paris. It’s natural (and he has the resources to do it, thanks to several managements).
By the way, I don’t drink. I did, however, just get off a plane from New York — no one up there seemed to give a crap about Starbury anyway. They were all pumped up about the Yankees. If the Knick fans don’t care, why do you?
Ajay Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 11:21 am
Its a good thing Marbury isnt asking for your advice…
Steph does not owe us anything — You say he needs to pay back the league and the knicks for making him wealthy? The league and the Knicks have made plenty of money off of him… Its a two-way street. The only thing he’s obligated to do is play out his existing contract. We’re constantly reminded that its just a business.
Just because he hasnt realized his potential in your eyes, doesnt mean he hasnt worked hard and earned what he has. This is his life– if he aspires to play in Italy/Greece/Guatemala, who are you/we to tell him he shouldnt. Even though he is in the spotlight, that doesnt mean his job is to appease the people watching.
I’m not even a big Marbury fan… I’m not stating any of this in his defense. I just read this article and thought to myself — What if I wanted to go work in Europe?? Would everyone critisize me and think I’m selfish? Do I owe my current employer more since they’ve paid me well the past 5 years? Nobody that matters would think any less of me for chasing my dreams and doing what I want with my life… I dont think it should be any different for Steph.
Stefan Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 2:00 pm
Um…Bennett’s got me confused. What team ever willingly pays for an underachieving player? And what the heck does Bennett mean when he says “every team would be in the playoffs”? I detect a several case of logical failure.
Furthermore, every single guy you mentioned (Johnson, Randolph, Redd and Wallace) gets Ws for his team, making their teams better (or at least moving them up in the rankings) Starbury doesn’t; he can’t even make himself better, let alone his team. Every team he’s been on has been better off without him. He’s the textbook definition overpayed. I happen to think Redd and Johnson make a bit too much money (relatively speaking, of course) but Randolph’s big points, big rebounds, big boy body are worth every penny. Oh, and Gerald Wallace? MJ and the Bobcats got away with grand larceny; watch him tear it up from inside and out this season and tell me 10 mill is overpaying him.
Eddie you rocked as a player, and you rock as a writer….Bennett, I disagree with you and your faulty logic gives me hives, but I wish you peace.
Bree Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 6:38 pm
Eddie…yes Rashidi tries with his stats but no he is not overboard just keeping you honest and making mince meat out of your ill informed observations.
As for Marbury to Europe…please get off your high horse on his timing, he was making an observation about the likihood of his not being signed, and he is right, he will not be signed. also Marburys conditioning is legend, this guy brings it every night physically, sure he has had laspes with the pressure of helping EZ Eddie Curry develop. He has had to pass the ball into a vacuum and then when it comes out be expected to make magic happen with 5 seconds on the shot clock. None the less he accepted is role and played his best season in years. The knicks were on track to make the playoffs but injuries held them one year shy of a return. And please review what Marbury had to work with towards the end of he season…all by himself sometimes 5 against one.
QRich….bad back, surgery
Jamal….bad ankle, surgery
EZ Ed…..Severe Bad passer
DLee…..Severe Foot Sprain
Mardy….Bum Knee and a Rookie
CFrye…..No Heart
Nate……No Head
Jarred jef.No Jumper, bad wrist
Jerome J.No Game and Plantar F.
Malik R…No Jumper
Balkman..No Jumper and a Rookie
Kelvin Kato..No Run
Not trying to be funny…this is real talk, how in the world did the knicks win 33 games with this bunch and Marbury gutting it out with tendinitis…I remember a game about mid season in Indiana when Marbury begged out of the game because of the pain in his knee…but had to stay in almost to end as no other knick could bring up the ball against the pressure…that was one of the 33 wins i remember well…he earned his check that night…and to be honest he earned his check the majority of last year and then sum. Again Eddie please stop mailing this in….and since you are so bold why not a column on how Stern was in denial on that podium yesterday….don’t think you will be in any rush to write about that any time soon…as you like easy targets.
Knick Knation is watching Ed…we are watching real hard this year.
Michael Bennett Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 8:36 pm
Actually, Eddie - Kobe is my new hometown guy. I’m moving to Los Angeles this weekend, so I’m forced to watch Kobe from the ninth row and see him work for every point and play. You know I love Kobe - I just like to put things into perspective.
And, he didn’t “work over” LeBron. Plus, who cares about USA minicamp? That’s like saying LaMarcus Aldridge will be an All-Star this year because he averaged 20 and 10 in Vegas summer league. Scrimmage games don’t matter… Why? Because both of their jerseys say USA on them at the end of the day.
Did you happen to catch the ESPYs? LeBrogrative was great. And, LeBron did a great overall job, moving him up even more as a package NBA player on and off (learning anything Kobe?) the court. Next up is the season premiere of SNL. He’ll do that while Kobe is icing his knees…
ComeNGetME Said,
July 25, 2007 @ 8:51 pm
“Of course, lost in all of this is that MARBURY HAS BEEN WORKING OUT THIS SUMMER. You talk like he’s spending his summers any different than most players who do charity work, travel to other countries, enjoy their offseason, etc. You think Nash is working on his game when he’s filming betterbasketball training videos?”
Taking a vacation, holding a charity basketball tournament and making some appearances are a bit different than doing a 38 city, cross-country tour that runs until August.
Do i think Nash is working out when he’s making a basketball video? Most likely. If Nash is anywhere near a gym, he’s working out. Thats the difference between a 2time MVP and a guy who’s never gotten out of the 1st round.
But like Eddie’s been saying, Steph has a bigger obligation to the NY Knicks. He was brought in to lead the team to a championship (we’ll settle for the playoffs at this point). He should only focus on this coming season and not his next move when hes a free agent. Or if he wants to focus on his next move, at least keep it internal. Whats he’s said may not be as damaging as Tiki announcing his retirement midseason, but its along the same lines. Once again, it’s always about Starbury.
Eddie Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 12:01 am
Rashidi
you are close to wall, although i hate all your crazy stats. i think you might deserve the Wall. What do you think Michael? (-:
Michael Bennett Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 12:32 am
Eddie - FOR: I think you hating all the crazy stats is reason enough to put Rashidi on the wall… Plus, he’s pretty dedicated to your blog. He’s consistently posting about all of your topics, and he seems to have a firm grasp on the game. Any time someone bugs me that much, I give them a little credit. It’s tough to really bug someone.
AGAINST: It’s not good to encourage someone to keep on with their useless stats and rants. Next thing you know, we’ll see page and a half posts about how many times Marbury used the word “yo” in his interviews.
But, I think…
WALL HIM!!! I’m getting lonely up there.
someone Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 12:50 am
Hey Eddie, this is unrelated to your article but I just thought I’d mention it.
I’m an Olympiakos fan from Greece and I just wanted to tell you that us Olympiakos fans have very fond memories of you.
I think the 1994-95 team you played on was the best team ever in European basketball and it was a shame that you didn’t win the European Championship that year.
I’ve always enjoyed reading your articles here by the way.
Chris Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 1:37 am
Marbury has been my favourite player for a while now and ive been disappointed with how hes performed over the past few seasons. I feel convinced and want it to be true that it was the role he was told to play, and thats what he did. I unfortunately dont see him having much success at turning back the clock this season personally but i know the team should be more successful. I cant help but think a player who has averaged 20 and 8 for this long cant do it again, let me know what ya’ll think!
Constantinos Meidanis Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 2:19 am
Hi Eddie, my name is Costas and i am from Greece.
Fortunately i had the chance to see you play for Olympiacos and i understand your concerns about this “crazy” style atmosphere, the pressure etc.
Personally i want to say “Thank you” after all these years for your performance and especially the Finals, which you helped us most to win the Championship. You should also know that you “Fast Eddie” are already a cult favorite for Olympiacos fans.
Although things have changed in the European Baskeball, it’’s been more that 10 years, since you played in Greece and many things have changed. Fiba Euroleague have changed, the Greek League have changed, and after the Olympic Games in 2004, there have been some major improvement for the safety of the athletes, the fans etc.
I understand your concerns about leaving a carreer in the NBA and crossing the ocean to play in Europe, but the game is also competive in Europe, each game in Euroleague has the same tension just like a game in the NBA Playoffs, and when it comes the time for the final act, then the feeling for an athlete is a reborn experience. Well,you should know better about that, because you participated in the Final Four with Olympiacos,
as in for Stephon Marbury, either he remains in the NBA or plays in Europe, i hope we will make the best decision for him.
Constantinos “Gus” Meidanis.
Athens Greece
jose freitas Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 2:40 am
Eddie
I remember you playing for Olympiakos the 95 Euroleague final vs Real Madrid. Steph would shit himself playing for that. Woolridge and Dominique could tell what pressure they got.
Then agaian some crap team would be glad to let him score 30 just to fill the stands.
Marbury is a drug addict, if anyone saw the ESPN interview.
Stefan Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 7:02 am
I agree with Jose…Marbury was high as a kite…and not just weed man, I mean Rocket Man high.
Scary
Andrew Scotti Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 4:39 pm
Eddie,
Regardless of the things these guys say, you have a view and opinion that none of us will be able to have till we play professional ball, which, i’m just assuming since it hasn’t come up, none of us have. my advice to you, eddie, tell your story, make your opinions, (which i happen to like mostly) and let them argue with each other, if they wanna take your words and distort them to how they read them, instead of how you wrote them, that’s their problem. make your point, and let them argue with one another… sitting back and observing an arguement can be alot more enlightening than getting involved in it.
keep it up though guys, everyone on here makes some good points… and some bad ones… but hey, you do all the research and whatnot and i get to see every angle of every arguement. its a win-win situation
Van Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 6:04 pm
Give me a break. U guys are coming down on Steph because he says he has a desire to play in Italy in 2 years. Hes a man. He makes his own decisions. And its not about money. Obviously considering his humongous salary this year. A man need challenges. And being on a subpar team going against the likes of Dallas Miami San Antonio. Im sure its getting a bit monotonous. So I dont blame Steph for feeling this way. He need a challenge. And so what he thinks Italy has it. Its not his fault his team is not willing to make the right decisions to put the right tallent with him. Hiring the primadonna Larry Brown didnt help neither. Other than that GO SONICS!
thomas Said,
July 26, 2007 @ 9:50 pm
marbury loves himself, im from conie island nd the rumor round hur is that since he knows he wont be remebered in america so he trying to go to italy to be remeber as the best player in italy good idea on his part but fiantialy not a good1
read me rashidi Said,
July 27, 2007 @ 11:50 am
“Of course, lost in all of this is that MARBURY HAS BEEN WORKING OUT THIS SUMMER. You talk like he’s spending his summers any different than most players who do charity work, travel to other countries, enjoy their offseason, etc. You think Nash is working on his game when he’s filming betterbasketball training videos?”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_yTjebH2fLU
watch this and tell me that marbury’s doin the right things this offseason… stefan said it pretty nicely
david Said,
July 29, 2007 @ 9:11 pm
well put eddie.
wherever stephon goes he never makes the team better. it really is such a shame though because he is so talented. gets into the lane and finishes, has range, good vision and runs the break well. It happened in min, in nj, in phx and now look at the knicks. the knicks on paper, over the last 2 years have had one of the best teams on paper in the league! he, being their starting pg should take a lot of the responsibility for their demise. also, if it wasn’t for his poor attitude, i bet they would have had a far more successful season when larry brown was coach.
it’s all about attitude and he has never had a good one
statusmvp Said,
August 10, 2007 @ 3:04 pm
his agent made him say this jus so ppl can think that he still cares for the game….he is tryin to save his own ass here….no african-american all-star nba baller who is making 20 million dollars a year is going to italy…NEVER EVER EVER IN A GAZILLION YEARS
uro55 Said,
August 11, 2007 @ 10:55 am
Damn Eddie you know you’re really full of yourself?
billy Said,
August 11, 2007 @ 10:26 pm
eddie you are so right. i have never read something ive agreed with in every aspect in my life until now. so well said. everything, perfect. wow.
agency johnson magic travel Said,
November 4, 2007 @ 3:10 pm
agency johnson magic travel
Have heard from it before, but is indeed a very good comment. Thanks.