Matrix reloaded
After hearing about Shawn Marion’s latest trade gossip and now a request that’s it’s time to move on, I just think this is the same song and dance over and over from All-Star players when they don’t want to step on toes if the trade doesn’t happen. I’m underrated and underappreciated, I’m tired of hearing trade rumors, I can’t get an extension, etcetera.
Here’s an excerpt from a conversation I overheard between Mike D’Antoni aka Morpheus and Shawn Marion aka the Matrix…
Morpheus: Have you ever had a dream, Shawn, that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from the dream, Shawn? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world? If “real” is that you play with a two-time MVP point guard, and that you are the highest paid player on the Suns then “real” is electrical signals your brain cannot interpret. What are you waiting for? You’re better than this. Don’t think you are, know you are. Come on! Stop trying to get a trade and work on getting the Suns a championship!
Matrix: I thought it wasn’t real?
Morpheus: Your mind makes it real
Matrix: So if I leave Phoenix, my career dies?
Morpheus: You cannot prosper without Phoenix. You have to see for yourself what the Matrix is. The Matrix is your game, Shawn. But when you’re inside the Matrix, you look around, what do you see? You are the highest paid player on the Suns, you just received a seven-time All-Star in Grant Hill to play alongside with, and Steve Nash is still your point guard. You have to understand, you are not ready to be unplugged. And you are so inert, so dependent on the team that Phoenix will fight to protect it. If you are not one of us, you are one of them. What you know you can’t explain, but you feel it. You’ve felt it your entire career, that there’s something wrong outside Phoenix. You don’t know what it is, but it’s there, like a splinter in your mind, driving you mad. You have the look of a man who accepts what he sees because he is expecting to wake up. Ironically, that’s not far from the truth. I’m trying to free your mind, Shawn. But I can only show you the door. You’re the one that has to walk through it. [Morpheus mumbles, "You better walk through that door Monday for training camp."]
Matrix: Why do my eyes hurt?
Morpheus: You’ve never used them before. And there is a difference between knowing the path and walking the path.
Matrix: What are you trying to tell me? That I can’t coexist with Kobe?
Morpheus: Shawn, I’m trying to tell you if you couldn’t coexist here with this perfect system for you then there is no place you can. (Especially the triangle offense or Jerry Sloan) Your game (The Matrix) is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth. You don’t have to create your own shot here with Nash spoon-feeding you and Barbosa and Hill slashing to the paint getting you dunk after dunk. What makes you think you will get a shot up when Kobe’s shooting 30 times a game. And what’s better… Running the floor next to Andrew Bynum or Amare Stoudemire? You’ve been living in a dream world, Shawn. Don’t wake up!
So after taking the tap off the phone (teasing), I encourage the Matrix to listen to the immortal words of Morpheus (the architect of a style and system that every athletic player loves to play).
Playing in the NBA is the ultimate dream job. Take my advice: don’t wake up! If you do, you will be real disappointed that you took the red and blue pill (if I got any Matrix movie fans!) because that one thing you won’t touch as much in L.A. or even Utah is the pill.
But if you won’t take my advice, speak to Neo (Joe Johnson). Everything worked out fine for him… Or did it not?
djhott Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:10 am
how bout marion for ilgauskus&daniel gibson
or marion to miami for jwill,u.haslem,d.wright,and 2 future 1st rounders
how or why in the hell would marion want to leave, who else will throw him oops, or what other team will let him slide for not having a 3pt shot
marion must not want to win, a marion kobe team would be nice, but even tho phoenix would still be better, they wont make that happen
marion is just made because he would rather walk, then be traded because of not being wanted anymore
Onur Tuncaboylu Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:12 am
If Suns would win the championship this year, or they could win last year, Marion wouldn’t get too much credit. He has a star potential, and he’s 3rd option in Suns. He can be the first option in a team like Orlando and can also get long-term contract extension.
Playing with two times MVP Nash, all right. But Marion was there before Nash. Marion was showing solid performances while playing with Marbury and he was an all-star before Nash addition.
Moreover D’antoni isn’t a charismatic leader like Morpheus and he still hasn’t got the trick of the ring in his mind
That’s why, Marion is right to be unhappy in Suns.
Siz Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:17 am
When Marion first came into the league, I was excited because he was an amazing, raw athlete and averaged something like 11 boards a game as a 3. He’s still a great athelte, but he is 30 now, so I’m sure some of that spring will fade soon.
The thing most concerning about a player like Marion, is that he’s making superstar money, but he doesn’t do superstar things. Larry, Mike, Magic, Duncan, Shaq, they worked on their games, worked on weak spots in their games, worked out in the summer. But as far as I can tell, Marion has the same exact game he had when he came into the league. Which is fine if I’m not paying him less than my 2 time MVP. But he’s making what, 17M a year? I even heard a quote from a former teammate that Marion never works on his game, and that it never seemed to occur to him that he could work on things to improve. How else can we explain the worst jumper in the league? How has that never been fixed? Marion is an unbelievable athlete, but once that starts to fade, I don’t think he’s worked on the other pieces of his game enough to compensate for the wearing down of his body.
So he should stay in Phoenix where the holes in his game will stay reasonably covered up.
djhott Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:18 am
best trades
marion&m.banks thats like 22 mil
for ilgauskus,damon jones,, and larry hughes
marion &09 pick for j.oneal
marion for a.jamison
marion for tim thomas&corey maggette
marion for shaquille oneal
Chad Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:24 am
Marion dd the same thing before nash came. Any point guard could do what nash does in that system. Nash is not that special. Kidd, Chris Paul could do the same thing with all that talent. And dont say nash made them talented cause stodemire was on the rise before he came. Nash is a solid point guard that will never lead his team to the championship. If kidd were on the suns he would
Chad Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:27 am
And Siz that was a brilliant comment, except you forgot to add kobe to those who work on their weak spots every year
Maximust Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 10:04 am
SO true!!! MAtrix cannot create is own shot…he is a slasher and Nash is the best point guard for him…whit Kobe he would had to face the reality to come up whit 20+ points every night… on the side of Kobe … you have to be a STUD!!! but still I don’t see him struggling in getting rebounds and having 15 ppg whit 2 steal every night…
Tom Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 10:19 am
worst trades..
1. phoenix are trying to pay less, not more.
2. ilgauskas, damon jones and larry hughes are all older or close to the same age as marion and are far less talented on a short bench team.
3. tim thomas isnt going back to phoenix
4. can you really see shaq in a phoenix uniform coming off the bench for amare?
5. i actually dont mind the jamison or j-o idea… but jamison straight up wouldnt be good enough and j-o is too expensive.
david Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 10:28 am
OK…here we go again — away from reality. Poor Shawn is not HAPPY
He only makes 17M a year (which I would imagine is a tad more than anyone is making who is writing on this blog — definitely more than me). As close as the Suns came last year you would think for that kind of money he would dig in and do what he could to get his team over the top.
As a Spurs fan I can only hope he stays with the Suns. He ties up (about 20 + % ??) of their salary cap and is easily shut down, as they proved in 2005 and 2007.
Josh Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 10:51 am
None of those trades would work. Cleveland already has a star small forward (where marion excells at) and that’s Lebron. Cleveland would never give up their starting Center and Shooting guard and back up point for one small forward. Indiana lacks size as it is, losing their only true big man would never happen. Marion for Jamison…maybe. doubt it since Washington likes Jamison, and he’s perfert at the position when healthy. Clippers…No way. They just lost Brand for the season, so they would never give up his back up and their main small forward just for marion. None of the trade would work unless the other team wanted Marion expiring contract and didn’t plan on extending his, so they could get rid of other overpaid contracts. Marion can’t go to LA because they have nobody to trade except Odom. The money doesn’t match. Marion is an awesome player. He needs to just stop while he’s ahead. Joe Johnson made the same mistake and now he’s the only real scorer in Atlanta. But who wants to score 25-30 a game for a team that loses. Thats just what Pierce had been doing the past couple of years. Marion has to stay. Maybe Phoenix will fix up a couple of play for him. Either way, I think they’re just a couple of pieces away from a championship. They need a swing man, like Keith Van Horn. Perfect for Phoenix. 07-08 Finals - Boston vs. Phoenix. I’m calling it.
Joe Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 10:56 am
I’ve got a trade idea that no one seems to be talking about:
Shawn Marion for Richard Jefferson and some filler (another player, draft picks, etc)
Marion would still get to play with an elite PG who could get him some easy baskets. The Nets would improve into one of the best teams in the East, and the Suns would be able to reduce their payroll and still get pretty good value in return for Marion.
djnott Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 11:21 am
I’m sorry djhott but you come up with the worst basketball advice I have ever heard on every blog that comes out of hoopshype. Ilgauskas can’t run in the Phoenix system. He is a half-court player, larry hughes has an albatross of a contract, can’t shoot, and is severely injury prone. A more realistic trade would be Marion for Odom which I doubt the Suns would help the Lakers, or AK-47 for Marion. The huge contract that AK has in the final years might dissuade the Suns, but they both play the 3 & 4, AK would welcome playing with Nash since the offense promises him touches, and it would be a nice change of scenery for the both of them. In Utah, I can see Marion getting more frustrated there though since it is more structured, and I don’t see him getting close to the numbers he got with the Suns but at least he is out of Phoenix.
Joshua Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 11:27 am
Shawn Marion is the BEST supporting player in the league. He can’t create his own shot, and his shooting form is disgusting. He wants $60 million over three years. Thats RIDICULOUS! STAT signed a 5 year for $70 million. Marion has always been insecure & just wants reassurance that he’s still important. Highest paid player on the best team in the league, 4 time all star & the guy we go to when a defensive stop is needed. He needs to realize that the money he is getting is MORE than adequite. He wants superstar money, but he doesnt have superstar skills. Until he develops some sort of ball handling skills, and have a successful playoff run ( not just one series ) he needs to be begging the Suns to keep him. If he gets traded to the lakers, he’ll be happy playing on an 8th seed team taking 10 shots a game just like Odom did. And at the end of the season when Kobe opts. out, he’ll be looking around for his old buddies Nash & Stoudemire. I love Marion and all but I’m sick of his whining, as is EVERYONE else interested in the Suns. Shut up and play. Put this all behind you and bring a championship back to Phoenix! We havent seen the Finals since 93′-94′!!! For christs sake the WNBA’s Mercury brought a championship to AZ. C’mon Trix! Get it together and be apart of something special.
Matt Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 11:42 am
There is no way Marion will flourish without a top notch point guard. Everyone forgets that he cannot create his own shot. The majority of his shots are either off of offensive rebounds, or fast break points. Put him in a system, say, like the lakers triangle offense, he is not going to do very well. Hope Matrix is ready for a rude awakening, and he can say good bye to the all-star team…………….sweet thinking buddy!!!
JYG Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 11:46 am
Nicely said D.B Very nicely said!!!!
Mike Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 12:36 pm
Dream???
I think all the mileage and hard work that Steve Nash has put his body through will catch up with him this year. The suns have plenty of talent, but as few would argue, nash is the heart of the team, and as he goes, so do the suns.
I see the team on a decline. They are no longer the favorable underdog. They will be expected to win each night, NO EXCUSES. Opposing teams have been working on countering the suns up tempo offense for a few years now, and they will make ground this year. Nash will be slowed down more this year.
Is this team better this year? Grant Hill? This is not 1997, the playoffs are in 2008!
The only good news is that spurs are on the decline also.
Dream. I don’t see it as a better situation than last year for marion. Although it was a good situation.
I think the suns better figure out how to make this guy happy. I think the suns need the matrix more than he needs them.
I am sure he would do just fine under Sloan.
imnobody Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 12:55 pm
Hey Siz…agreed with everything you said EXCEPT one thing.
Shaq has been eating double cheeseburgers all summer long for the last decade. Can’t put his work ethics in the same sentence as Mike, Larry and Magic.
I love Matrix’ game…but Marion is all about Marion. You think he’s after more shots opportunities? It’s not about basketball, guys. Marion is after the recognition and props of being “the man” on a bad team. That’s all there is to this.
Mike Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 1:00 pm
Hey - if someone in upper management made it clear that they are trying to get rid of you because they feel you do not produce per the agreed salary, would you be saying:
“this is my dream job!”
steve kerr - this is what you are paid for. fix it.
Ron Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 2:54 pm
Wow Dee Brown!
That was purely poetic! I was a Shawn Marion fan before he WAS Matrix and still am. But you couldn’t have put it better, it is a dream system for any player that comes to play with Nash, Amare, Bell, and the D’Antoni system. And it is “made to order” for Matrix to get maximum oppotunities for his game. Without it, his trips to the All Star game will be heavily dependent on the rest of the cast.
KG left Minnie in search of a championship - Trix wants to leave Phoenix in search of? Like you said, don’t wake up Shawn. Stay in the dream and we all will win.
Rashidi Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 2:59 pm
Joe Johnson got a huge contract that Phoenix wasn’t willing to give to him.
I am sure he is more than happy with his decision.
If Marion joined Kobe, it would be the closest thing to Jordan and Scottie since… Jordan and Scottie.
david Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 3:39 pm
Rashidi, with all due respect — you miss the point. JJ left to get his money — congrats !! Marion has been well compensated for a mediochre player. And he still whines. I think the Suns would be overjoyed to dump him, even to a division rival. Word is they spend an inordinate amout of time trying to make him happy. This is for a guy who makes $207,000.00 per game (82 regular season games — preseason and post season on the house). And this is for playing basketball!!
Eric Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:17 pm
As a Suns fan, the trade I want to see is Shawn Marion and Marcus Banks to the Kings for Ron Artest, Kenny Thomas, and Douby. The Kings might want to get rid of the PR nightmare in Artest and the Suns can finally get someone that has the defensive toughness never seen in purple and orange.
Jacob N Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:20 pm
rashidi,
you get worse every topic i see your name in… joe johnson isn’t making 17 million a year… so joe johnsons contract is irrelevant with marions contract discussions…
kobe and marion will be like pippen and jordan?? thats crazy talk… no one will be jordan and pippen because no one else has won 6 championships… and the lakers dont have half the supporting cast the bulls did
if that trade were to happen, which i hope it does (being a celtics fan) it will make the suns weaker eliminating one of the top 3 beasts of the west.
david Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:28 pm
Jacob, I think that trade would make the Suns stronger. It would essentially replace Kurt Thomas and just what has Marion done for them lately. As I said, being a Spurs fan, I hope he stays put.
Damiano Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:37 pm
Bellissimo!
Great idea! …and I think is the truth! …but dont’t u think that ak47 will fit perfect? …really attractive idea too…
ELove Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:40 pm
I’m from the CHI and Marion isn’t half the player Scottie was
I understand Marion’s frustration BUT someone with his limited skillset should be TOO HAPPY to be making 17 million a year
Joe Johnson is a Highly-Skilled player and he’s Very Tough and Phoenix wasn’t going to pay him NOWHERE NEAR what he ended up getting with Atlanta
Jason Kidd would make ANYBODY a better player (see Kenyon Martin) but RJ makes less than Marion and RJ has a jumpshot and also plays defense… WHY would New Jersey want a player that you would have to Pay More (Marion) that does Less than the player you’re giving up (RJ)
Rashidi Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:58 pm
“Marion has been well compensated for a mediochre player.”
Marion is hardly a mediocre player. He has been the glue that has held the franchise together his entire career. He was there through the Kidd years, the Marbury years, he was there when Nash came, he was the reason they still won big even when Amare went down.
He is easily the team’s best defensive player and rebounder despite playing small forward.
He is the best small forward in the game right after LeBron.
And all you fans don’t see that. Nash gets the credit. Amare gets the credit. People talk about Marion like he is nothing without Nash - like he wasn’t doing his thing before Nash got there.
And he still whines. I think the Suns would be overjoyed to dump him, even to a division rival. Word is they spend an inordinate amout of time trying to make him happy. This is for a guy who makes $207,000.00 per game (82 regular season games — preseason and post season on the house). And this is for playing basketball!!
Jacob N Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 4:20 pm
“rashidi, joe johnson isn’t making 17 million a year… so joe johnsons contract is irrelevant with marions contract discussions…”
Then why did Dee Brown mention it at the end of his blog? Urf derf.
“kobe and marion will be like pippen and jordan?? thats crazy talk…
“no one will be jordan and pippen because no one else has won 6 championships…”
Uh, whats your point? Jordan didn’t have any championships until Pippen came along.
Kobe is the best SG in the league, just like Jordan was at the time. Marion is a top defensive player and rebounder, he doesn’t need to be the man to be effective. JUST LIKE PIPPEN.
When did I say Kobe/Marion would = Jordan/Pippen. I said it would be the closest thing since. Learn to read before I punk you again.
(And since Kobe has three rings and is under 30, I would think he has a better chance of getting to six than most players)
“and the lakers dont have half the supporting cast the bulls did”
NEWSFLASH - when Jordan and Pippen joined up they didn’t have much of a supporting cast either. Give them a year.
“and just what has Marion done for them lately.”
Lead them in rebounding and blocked shots. For the last 7 years or so.
Oh, and make 4 all-star teams in the last 5 years.
The question should be “What has Lamar Odom done lately?”
david Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 5:15 pm
So what if he’s their leading rebounder and shot blocker? What has THAT accomplished? WHen the Spurs smacked the Suns 2 years ago they made it a point to neutralize Marion. He all but disappeared.
This year they didn’t have to key in on him at all.
My point, Rashidi, Is that if a team is PAYING you $200K PER GAME, (even if someone somewhere is making more than you — get over it), you owe it to your employer to play your best, improve your game, make people around you better than they were before they met you, and quit whining like a sorry bitch. He’s a whiner, not a winner.
Get a reality check.
Dave Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 5:27 pm
Now it is CLEAR that the Suns should have pulled the trigger and dealt Marion for Garnett, an MVP two years ago and still one of the top 5 players in the league….should have done this while they still could…They know Marion is unhappy about his role, they knew he’d be pissed to have no discussion of contract extension….Plus BORIS DIAW will have a larger role next year, and the additional of HILL who plays same position will limit his minutes.
Garnett makes more sense because Garnett would play beside Diaw a lot better than Marion. Garnett is a top outside shooter so can stay on the perimeter better than Marion, and also has the flexibility to slide and play even the C if needed in Phoenix system…he could play any position really of the 5 positions….and as a great passer would help when Nash is out making plays. And he is a TOP TOP defender.
Anoher great thing about the Garnett deal, is Garnett would basically have opted out after a year and resigned a 4 year deal for probably 56M$… That would mean the first year of the deal would be 11M$… meaning an 8M$ CAP REDUCTION next year which would be great for the team.
Than as part of that deal they should have dealt BANKS to ATL for Tyronn Lue who is in mold of Nash, and perfect for suns…super athletic, can hit 3PT, defend, pass, and he has an exp. contract meaning by dumping banks they now have 11M$ in additional cap savings.
Now they are stuck with this drama on a team that was known for chemistry…Marion will struggle with Diaw playing an extended role and Hill.
PHO was smart to pull trigger on signing Brian Skinner, but still don’t have a real C on the team. Burke should be waived, give him a front office position if you want, Waive Piatkowski…Try really hard to get PJ Brown PLEASE.
The Suns front-office has really been asleep at the wheel, and cheap, dumping 6 1st round picks these last two off-seasons, and in doing so not having a young player that could replace Nash when he gets older or Stoudmire if he breaks down.
The Garnett deal would have just been amazing for the suns, that and getting Tyronn Lue and PJ Brown this team would be a lock for the title, and drama free.
Blame Steve Kerr.
Squirrel Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 5:45 pm
Me likes this excerpt very much! Way to go Dee!
TheTruthSquad Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 6:25 pm
I have the trade that will work. Joe Johnson for Marion. Johnson can come back to the Suns and complain about getting no love again and Marion can play for a bunch of losers.
young, black, and gifted Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 6:28 pm
I love the analogy dude……………as a journalist, sports enthusiest, and pop culture buff I appreciate your writing style. Kept me reading.
dhneslie Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 7:48 pm
Of course everything worked out for Joe Johnson. He wouldn’t be an all star and he wouldn’t get paid as being paid now if he had stayed in Suns. But..but..but..Marion is not a JJ. He needs a fit point guard who will create a room for Marion to play. Like Nash..Like Marbury..Who is going to be that guy in Orlando? Nelson? Arroyo? Don’t think so..In Lakers? Farmar? ..Crittenton? in several years, definetly yes..Cleveland? No way..
P.s. JJ didn’t need a point guard, did not need anybody..He can do that job, and he did it. Would have been great if he had a center, but he survived even without one and became an all star..didn’t he?
Rashidi Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 8:09 pm
I find it interesting that you keep saying 200K per game, because Marion is also incredibly durable and plays the majority of the game. He plays the most minutes on the team and never misses games.
Can’t say the same about Nash or Amare.
Are you trying to say Marion is overpaid? Look at the deal Rashard Lewis just got. Look at the deal former teammate Stephon Marbury got. Hell, look at what the Suns are paying Boris Diaw. Over 100K a game. What’s his value to the team compared to Marion’s?
If the Suns are going to give all this money and security to guys like Diaw, why shouldn’t Marion want a big extension after everything he’s given the team through the years?
frank Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 8:26 pm
first off, let’s stop comparing marion to scottie. scottie was a better in every facet of the game then shawn will ever be. and to think that a marion/kobe duo can be in the same sentence as jordan/pippen is taking crazy pills. pippen was the bulls primary ball handler against the press and initiated the triangle in their half court set. he also possessed one of the quickest first steps at the time, and had a decent back to the basket game.
i’m not discounting the skills that marion possesses. he’s a lock down defender, and a good rebounder at his size. but he also has an erratic jumper, and has yet to prove he can create his own shot. playing with nash has definitely benefited his career, along with playing with kidd as rashidi has pointed out. he’s a finisher. he’s kenyon martin with longer range and without the nagging injuries (k-mart was an all star with kidd).
Stefan Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 8:34 pm
Chad, you’re dead wrong about Nash. The guy is a fitness fanatic and still in top shape. I see him being in his prime for two more years, never mind slowing down.
Marion is, like many have suggested, a fantastic backup guy who can’t create off the dribble and needs his feeds. He’s a freak of an athlete but just like my favourite philisophical-sci-fi movie, he’s getting a bit dated and the fact that he has to rely on athleticism over developing other strengths. This will begin to hurt him in the near future. People’ll be calling him the Matrix and dudes coming in the league with 42″ verticals will be saying “Hey, that’s my dad’s favourite movie”.
Stefan Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 8:40 pm
Rashidi,
What exactly has Marion given the Suns that they haven’t paid him back for? He’s earned tens of millions of dollars doing what he does; I’d say that’s more than fair. The Suns don’t owe him anything. This team needs to win and must have guys that are going to sacrifice a bit of attention and take one for the team. It’s becoming clearer by the day that the Matrix is not that kind of guy. If I were Kerr, I’d drop him for a serviceable forward who can run and some seriously juicy draft picks.
Peace
Melvin Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:20 pm
Look, do you think they can ever find a player (I mean a complementary hardworking player) better than the Matrix…???
On the flipside a player that is not happy can not make his team win either…
And a “cheapskate” team can never sign playrs if they don’t have money…
Whew Basketball world…
Visit this one;
http://basketballnonsense.blogspot.com/
jackalo Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 9:36 pm
marion is the best player in the nba and deserves as much money as he wants without him the suns aint shit
RayNate Said,
September 27, 2007 @ 11:46 pm
First I have to give props to Rashidi for shuttin’ haters down. And I think Matt’s trade of Marion for Jefferson (don’t know about money though, I don’t thnk Jersey can afford to give anyone away) actaully has merit. they are very similar players. If anything I’m curious how each would be able to thrive.
Now I have to spit some venom. How can anyone clown his shooting mechanic (ugly as it is) and ignore the fact that his shots still drop. Who cares really so long as it goes in and he’s not chucking them up like Antoine Walker behind the arc. Get real people. Now I will agree that he thrives with a run and gun point guard, but wait who wouldn’t? One of the prime uses for a point guard is to feed people the ball to score. Don’t let the Allen Iverson’s and Gilbert Arenas’s fool you (not to take too much away from them b/c they are good), it’s not all about thier PPG. Is he overpaid? Probably, but how many players in the NBA aren’t overpaid and underskilled or even worse overskilled and underpaid (can you say ‘dwayne wade’). If players were actually paid based on thier PROVEN skills ( notice I said ‘proven,’ this means they perform at a level consistant with their pay grade every game) then I guarantee, teams like the Knicks would be way, way, way under the salary cap. Marion may not be the superstar he thinks he is but he’s still one of the best (and i lookm at his games not his allstar apearances or anything like that b/c the NBA hype machine can make or break anybody). And who thought Shawn would be a good addition to the Laker is smoking crack. If we look at Phil Jackson’s cowning achievement, the Chicago Bulls we see a trend. all his teams focus around a shooting guard (as we saw in the pagan god of basketball Michael Jordan or more recently Kobe), an under-rated but not superstar caliber small forward (as we saw in scotty pippen) and a big man who bangs the boards (as we saw with Horace Grant and most notably Dennis Rodman). Everybody else is either an all around role-player or a specialist (see BJ Armstrong, Stever Kerr, Ron harper….). The Lakers have pieces of this type of team but not the whole thing. It would be a waste for marion to go here. Finally, my thought is that Shawn should stay where he is and stop talking so much. I can understand his feelings as far as the trade rumors go. I can even understand his gripe with feeling like he’s some bum that hasn’t done anything (you think pippen didn’t feel the same way). There is one key thing that is missing though. Pippen, regardless to how he felt, kept his eye on the prize, a ring (or several in his case). And for all his effort he is now remembered as a great player not just for playing with Jordan but for playing well all the time. So in short, shut up, suck it up and focus on getting that ring (Becuase Phoenix is dangerously close to being the best team in the NBA and the most fun to watch).
Steve Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 12:02 am
I never get the he “disappeared” in the playoffs yes on the offense side of the ball he did but he was the only/is the only one capable of containing Tony Parker .Nash and Amare disappeared on the Defense side of the ball but know one says they disappeared .
As a huge Spurs fan and a big hater of the SUNS i would LOVE if Marion got his wish because he fits there scheme so well and there isnt a player they can get that can fill the role beside maybe Tyrus Thomas and Kirenko but they cant cover on Shooting guards and Small Fowards like he can . I dont think people realize how important he is with the “long rebounds” which is HUGE because the Suns like to throw threes up and more importantly make other teams throw threes up rather then inside baskets .
With all that said i still dont blame the SUNS not paying a 30 year old tons of money that relys on Athelic ablity alone . I think this is a lose lose situation for both sides he isnt winning anything without the Suns and the Suns arent without him so this makes me happy hahahah =)
Siz Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 12:07 am
Imnobody…haha, I get your point about Shaq. I’ll give him a little credit, he used to ONLY dunk…but he developed some other moves, and also took the backseat to Wade, so I gotta give him some credit. In those other guys class? Probably not.
I honestly thought I was get murdered for my comments about Marion. It’s amazing to me that so many people feel the same way.
And to the other commenter waayy up there…I didn’t mean to imply at all that Kobe doesn’t work on his game during the summer…I was just throwing out some examples off the top of my head. Kobe is amazing…I find it frustrating to watch his prime go by with such a weak team. But, alas, this is what he wanted. He should have known Shaq was going to decline soon…and it would have been his team sooner or later. And even I’m better than Kwame. But I think Chris Mihm could take me though.
I haven’t looked to see how contracts work out, but the only trades I like are the one for AK47, and the one for Richard Jefferson. I’m not that hard on AK 47, I hear Sloan is just the biggest prick of a coach, even though he is obviously very effective. RJ has a better offensive arsenal than Trix, but you lose some D. RJ isn’t a terrible defender, but Marion is awesome in that area.
Did anyone read that Suns book….7 Seconds or Less? (I think that’s the name)
Kingsblade Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 2:36 am
People keep talking about Marion’s salary but there are other things to look at as well.
Marion also led the team in minutes played and took more shot than Stoudemire did. (I never checked, but I think he was second on the team in shots to Barbossa.)
I have never heard of a player take more shots and play more minutes while simultaneously crying about the ‘respect’ he deserves.
He is a ridiculous excuse for an athlete and deserves to play for the Knicks. Maybe Isaiah will tell him he loves him and offer some ”off-site’ time to prove it. I only wish we could see what a season or 2 there does for his attitude. (and his game)
I also love how people here can point to his single pre-Nash all star appearance and say he was doing exactly the same thing before Nash came. Let me get this straight:
Marion squeaks into the all star game once. Then Nash shows up and Marion becomes a perennial all star, yet Nash somehow did not improve Marion’s game. Do I have it right?
Makes perfect sense. Brilliant in fact, since it seems to ignore logic in exactly the same manner as Marion does when he claims he gets no respect.
djhott Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 4:18 am
djnott whatever, the point is too move marion and make stoudemire even happier to be able to play powerforward instead of center
i agree with the marion for jefferson and fillers,
and shaq would be the center in phoenix
and can u come up with any better trades?
and with ilgauskus u get a starter who could get 13 8 in phoneix or small ball the 6th man, hughes is the other defender they need, jones is an extra 3 point shooter,
the fact of the matter is barely any realistic trade will make them better, the fact is the spurs outplayed them, the suns just need to play harder, if nash is the catalyst, how come marion cant step up and be the 2nd man?
AND YEA MY BLOGS ARE OFF WALL, BUT SOMEHOW IM A PAID BASKETBALL RECRUITOR FOR YOUR INFORMATION.
AND MARION IS OVERPAID, JUST LIKE RASHARD LEWIS
A MARION FOR RASHEED WALLACE,AARON AFFALO,AND RONALD MURRY
WOULD WORK AND FOR 16 MIL WHO THE HELL WOULD WANT KIRALENKO, BUT HIS DEFENSE IS DECENT-IF AMARE &KURT THOMAS COULDNT STOP DUNCAN, THEY NEED TO GET A BIGGER CENTER, OTHER THAT THAT THERE IS NO BETTER TALENT A TEAM COULD ASK FOR, WITH 2 GREATS OFF THE BENCH IN BARBOSA^DIAW, HILL IS A GOOD WITH HILL AND DIAW AT THE 3 AND AMARE BACK TO THE 4-U HAVE ARE JUST MISSING A CENTER, AND WITH A 3/4 LIKE MARION THAT GETS U 20 AND 11 U COULD GET ANY CENTER BUT YAO, OR DWIGHT HOWARD-OR THE LAST TRADE WOULD BE MARION TO NY FOR DAVID LEE, NATE ROBINSON AND JARED JEFFRIES, THE SUNS SAVE, GET SIZE AND A PLAYER I THINK WILL BE NICE IN ROBINSON, OR MARION TO THE BUCKS FOR CHARLIE VILLANOVA, DAN GADZURIC,BOBBY SIMMONS AND A 09 PICK
DEARMEAT Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 4:32 am
LAMAR ODOM, JORDAN FARMAR,AND MARC GASOL FOR MARION
gio Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 6:10 am
if i were marion. i would stay in phoenix. coz i know thats where i play great and i fit in right with the system. “run and gun!” thats what the suns do best.
Trades:
-kirilenko would not fit with suns coz even though he’s good in defense, he does’nt have offense.
-odom, versaile, left handed, can shoot and pass. can run and dunk. just as long as he is consistent and healthy.
-richard jefferson might be a good fit. just maybe. but still not as great as the matrix.
-ilgauskas & hughes won’t fit. damon jones, maybe for the 3’s.
-jermaine o’neal?! wow!. good trade if it would happen.!
line-up for 2008:
c amare stoudemire/ brian skinner
pf shawn marion/ boris diaw
sf grant hill, eric piatkowski
sg raja bell, leandro barbosa, alando tucker
pg steve nash, marcus banks, dj strawberry
if marion stays,the phoenix suns-> champs! in 2008!.
david Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 9:13 am
Rashidi, you are as immature as Marion. “Look at what Rashard got…look at me …look at me…” That’s how all this salary nonsense spun way out of control (starting with Jon Koncack / Hawks if oyu remember back that far).
You think minutes played, points scored, stats, All Star appearances determine the complete value of a player, yet there are so many more intangibles.
The most successful basketball franchise of the last 9 years, the Spurs, relies more on chemistry around Duncan than anything else. Popovitch has a saying: “The first thing we do when we bring in a new player is to help him get over himself.” Look at Manu coming off the bench to make Finley stronger. Look at Elson and Oberto sharing the center spot — whichever matches up better to the opposition.
Then take a look at Marion and you can see why Phoenix has always been a bridesmaid, never a bride.
space Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 9:21 am
david—
koncak! now that’s rich. but marion IS ‘mr. intangible’
shooting motion, age, creating on his own?
the bottom line is results.
only the results that matter. marion is an absolute athlete. his approach, vision and overall game improved by being a member of the phoenix suns and learning from steve nash to a degree. this team and its general compliment him perfectly. that said, it does not mean that he wouldn’t be an effective player anywhere else. he will be a significant contributor, just in a different way. just give him a decent running, passing point guard and his numbers will be close or better for years to come. he got the most recognition when the Suns started winning.
and being 30?
SHAWN MARION is 29 AND WILL NOT BE 30 UNTIL NEXT MAY
nash is 33 now and will be 34 mid season. let’s not forget he was dumped by dallas for the same ’someone younger’ mythology. haha. no one even imagined [except myself when he was a rookie] that he could be MVP consecutive times. i doubt that would happen if shawn were to go elsewhere, but be wary of the future.
BY THE WAY—
what reporter was standing next to him as he bad-mouthed his franchise this time? honestly, i’ve never seen marion go off on a tirade about being upset in all the years [maybe i live under a rock] so i have to call it media speculation yet again. i guess that’s the 1st time that’s ever happened.
SHAWN MARION is a BASKETBALL PLAYER.
many might be surprised in what he could do outside of his current environment. —the overall perception is that he is a piece of the Suns machine and they could win without him. its is possible to a degree, but marion really never receives the credit for being able to board, defend, steal, score, run, pass, and at the same time defer his game and keep it in a box whenever nash, joe johnson or amare were hot. even if he could hoist an easy 25-30 on his man. the ability to defer is one that he hasn’t gotten credit for the most in actuality. and his salary ain’t that bad either.
Suns management does REALLY great stuff, then sometimes REALLY bad stuff.
the Suns GM need not blow this one the way they did the center position over the years, they’ve O-so-soft in the middle since letting steven hunter go. they might’ve gotten past the spurs if he were on the roster. the only relatively DECENT deal would’ve been for garnett. that’s dead so they need to kill any 2 or 3rd rate deal that teams are throwing at them.
Rashidi—
thanks for speaking the truth
DJhott—
wallace would be a good fit, but if age is so important why get a another more mature headcase 4 years older… and what would the pistons do with two small forwards in marion and tayshaun prince? the knicks trade line sounds good [i'd pay to see david lee start finally], but they still lose to the spurs and rockets for lack of a decent man in the middle.
lenitch Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 9:30 am
Dudes,
I’m a huge Suns fan (till 1989).
I loved the team and we all know that our style is runnin’ & sharin’.. as basketball will always be by the way..
But Marion is breaking the chimestry till last season.
If u have saw nearly all games the last 3 years you have felt the difference and more how much Nash was pis*** off by that..
Marion is no more a great guy and believe me or not I will loved to see him being crap in LA and having problem to get a new big contrat.
For me he is king of a new Sprewell.. a guy with a HUGE ego.. a perfect fit with Kobe so they will complain all the thius together.. haha
Bring back a nice Odom (who dominate Marion the last 2 years in playoffs) or even better a huge baller as Kirilenko (suns will be unbeatable with him)..
Hope we trow him away.. he deserve nothin’ more than that..
He was nice.. he’s no more.. I hate him right now..
Bye bye Matrox…
lenitch Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 9:41 am
by the way..
Phoenix can’t win games without Nash..
Phoenix may have 60 wins without Marion.. and we see it allready.
When Marion don’t play, no probs to win it..
The guy is makin’ 17m. with the garbage of the suns.. please understand that in another franchise HE IS NOTHIN more than 16pts/8reb.. but u will see… I’m sure he’s gone already..
Peace Suns fan and F***** the S.A Sterns !!!!! (and LA lakers too)
hahahaaa
Anthony Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 9:51 am
I think Marion sees that the suns being champions is more hype than substance.
The suns don’t have a defense to win a championship (and that must be tough for Marion since he is their best defender). My picks for the top playoff teams in the west are San Antonio, Dallas (I don’t think a GS will jump on them this year), Phoenix, with Utah and Houston close behind. Phoenix will win alot of games in the regular season, and beat up on the 6-8 seed, but will have trouble with any of the above teams. Nash will be beaten down at the end of the season.
Why not go to a different team where you are more appreciated. I’d be pissed too if my boss said I didn’t do enough for what I was paid. IF YOU THINK NASH AND AMARE SHOULD BE PAID MORE THAN MARION, PAY THEM MORE. YOU SIGNED MARIONS CONTRACT! Is Diaw worth his contract? What has that guy done, save money on him (Oh, he is not tradeable because he is grossly overpaid!).
Will Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 10:00 am
Before Nash,
Marbury. Suns below .500. Marbury hogs ball. People (This could be Marion, Stoudemire) stand around a lot. Marbury heaves up ball, so predictable, Phoenix sucks.
Nash shows up, w/same people, Phoenix is a top tier tiem. Who is this Chad earlier poster who needs brain surgery?
Marion is an outstanding player. Nash makes him a superstar. Period.
Nash feeds these players easy scores with motion and great passing.
Joe Johnson went to Atlanta. Atlanta still sucks, real bad.
Marion wants more shots, even though he takes the most shots in Phoenix. If he plays with Kobe, he will get 1/2 the shots he is getting now.
Marion needs Dry-Loc for his brain.
JEB Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 10:04 am
i would take Marion over Stoudmire
david Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 10:21 am
Space,
My point is that Marion DOES receive the credit for what he does on the court, to the tune of 17M. Isn’t that enough? OR does he need to be told by everyone just how wonderful he is so he can feel good about himself?
Yeah, Koncack…remember when someone offered him 1 million per year and Atlanta matched it? That set off a string of “what about me’s” and basketball has never been the same since.
Beat Kondukta Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:05 am
You should stay, Shawn. This team is yours. Not Amare’s team. Never. It’s your team
baller Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:09 am
I have to mention what most ppl seem to be forgetting. Amare missed a lot of games when he had the microfracture surgerie. And If i remember correctly Marion came up big in his absince, I remember 30 and 20 games almost every night. I even recall some 40,20 games. He is perhaps not the best shooter in the game and not the best ball handler. But the dude has an very fast first step and is a killer offencive rebounder. I actually think that he would do pretty good outside of phonix.
I also have to agree with what someone said about the nash-kidd comparision. I actually think that kidd would have a better chance at makin the suns champs. he has similar assist numbers in a worse team scores a little less but who cares hes a point guard. but he’s averaging lik 9 rebounds and is a fierce defender. Nash has not defended anything unless his mvp title since he came in the leagu. And what do the suns lack? D.
Jax Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:21 am
i do not consider Marion as a Superstar or All-Star in that regard. Superstars are those guys who could carry his team, not necessarily to the playoffs but someone who could “carry” a team. Marion’s game is definitely of that caliber… He is a great player and in fact one of my favorites (specially in fantasy leagues) however I don’t think he can carry a team on his own. He’ll never the be go-to-guy but arguably the best 2nd man on any team. He if insists on being traded, I think he would excel only with the : Nets, Warriors and perhaps the Mavs. He might be the missing piece on that Mavs team.
Jax Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:23 am
what i mean is that Marion’s game is definitely NOT of that caliber… i missed the “NOT” word in my preceding statement
space Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:37 am
david—
i definitely agree with you. my rant is to all the previous jokes i read over the last couple days that downplayed his value. and no doubt, 17M is a LOT of money. quality vets can pull 8-12 million. and we see where marion is on that measure. i hope he’s not beefing about the cash.
legitimate question: the highest paid guy should shoot the most. not that i know if it would work but have the suns ever tried making him the #1 option? did they win?
david Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 11:52 am
Space, I think there is more to basketball than shooting (although I might get shot by Eddie for writing that). I have no problem with Marion’s game — he’s really pretty good. It’s just his attitude. If he wants to “win”, his best chance is with the Suns. They are a BIG away from being pretty scary.
Wasn’t Marion the #1 option before Nash and Amare arrived?
gabe Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 12:32 pm
the suns will keep marion.
if the main reason for moving marion is to save money, then it makes no sense to trade him. $ have to be relatively close. so what are gonna trade for? An expiring contract next year? Marion will bolt at end of year anyways! Odom and AK will expect contract extensions soon enough anyways.
the positive: marion is a solid player. he will play hard to up his value for the contract extension
the negative: marion’s focus might be on his new team before the playoffs begin.
Siz Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 1:41 pm
What I think is ironic is that one of the commercials he did, the one where he had the sweatshirt on, and underneath he had on a weighted vest, is that even there he didn’t do anything but dunk. They couldn’t even write a 30 second script for him to ’showcase his moves’.
Stefan Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 1:50 pm
Steve Kerr’s got to get rid of this guy.
Possible trades: I’d take Zaza PACHULIA (is he still with Atlanta?), Lue, and the Hawks ‘08 1st round pick…heck I’d take even less if it were possible. The kind of negative energy a prima donna wannabe exudes can be destructive.
If I were in his place I’d be dying to stay on that team. I’d ask them to cut my salary in half and lock me up for the rest of my career. Marion is either stupid or is listening to someone who’s running up his ego, inflating his sense of self-worth. I wasn’t even aware that he was even making nearly-max money; now he wants a max extention? Give me a f****n break.
Stefan Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 1:51 pm
Shawn Marion for Dan Gadzurich, straight up…..someone call the Bucks.
Rick Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 1:52 pm
For the record Marion’s numbers have remained the same since about his second year in the league. Regardless of the point guard situation (Kidd, Marbury, Barbosa, Nash). He continues to find ways to answer the call on both ends of the floor. There are not many players in the league who are as productive on both ends and log as many minutes as Marion. Here’s a guy that plays both forward spots and made the absence of Amare for a whole year seem like not such a big deal. Please don’t forget that he’s been assigned to guard everyone from Duncan, Brand and Nowitzki to Rashard Lewis, Paul Peirce and T-Mac.
I am not a Marion lover but I do feel in sports today people feel athletes should just shut up and accept what they are given, People also feel money is a cure all.
I think Marion and guys like him are concerned with their personal sports legacy as well as team success and when a player tries to establish his or her personal mark on the game they are seen as selfish a-holes.
Society applauds the players who will ‘fill their role’ and ‘do their part’ for teams and never strive to be the absolute best at what they do. T-Mac and Joe Johnson are just a couple of players that come to mind who had the choice to be a 2nd, 3rd or 4th option on a team but decided to step out and lead a team themselves. Now they have not won rings but neither have the teams they left. They have become All-Stars, made a lot of money and will be a bigger part of their team and NBA history. On the flip side they receive more criticism and media pressure but that’s part of the game.
In Phoenix today, nobody discusses the consistency and impact of Marion on a constant basis. It’s always ‘Is Nash MVP worthy again?’ ‘Will Amare be the same?’ ‘Is Nash’s back ok?’ “Is Nash the best point guard ever?’ ‘Will Amare improve defensively?’
Marion’s saying ‘I’m a great player, one of the best forwards in the game, rarely miss a game, and Nash and Stat get all the love!’ He’s been branded as a one dimensional player that is only as successful as his point guard. How can you fault him for wanting to shake that? D’Antoni is not going to change the game plan so the Matrix can display his ball handling and shot creativity.
Marion is not asking for a franchise tag. He just wants to be respected for his work and get out from under Nash and Stoudemire’s shadow. He’s thinking LA is big enough for he and Kobe which may be right considering he’s not a Shaq-sized personality.
I ain’t mad at that. Do you Shawn! ‘Cause nobody else will look out for you.
space Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 2:11 pm
the Suns are in a win NOW situation. they’re window is closing fast. and true, if he does want to win, his best chance is with the suns. if he is ready to leave then he’s got a bad perception of reality or maybe Suns land isn’t all that sunny? remember joe johnson bolted from a really promising team.
Was marion ever the 1st option? i don’t know, but with marbury on your team i doubt it [haha], he might’ve been in the kidd years though.
—atlanta’s 1st round pick shouldn’t be worth squat in ‘08 if hawks win 35-40 games.
—they already own somebody’s 1st rounder anyway.
gabe Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 3:18 pm
ask for your salary to be cut in half? you’d have to be a moron to do that.
50% of a players game is defense. Nash and Amare are mediocre at best.
marion is an exceptional defender who has to often guard power forwards substantially bigger. why isn’t amare locking down on the these guys?
don’t underestimate the value of durability. amare didn’t produce sitting on the bench last year, but got paid big bucks (talk about being overpaid!) I know injuries happen, but give a guy credit for avoiding them.
talk about getting old, if Nash loses half a step his career will backslide in a blink of an eye (Stockton).
marion can’t create his own shot. when is putting back offensive rebounds not creating shots for yourself?
steve kerr - you hung this guy out to drive over the summer. now kiss his @$$
gabe Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 3:19 pm
I meant “dry”
Kingsblade Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 4:39 pm
@space
I don’t know if you read my previous post or not, but Marion did take more shot than Stoudemire this past year. He also lead the team in minutes.
This is relevant because while he cries about getting no respect he is already jacking over a thousand shots, playing more than anyone else, and being paid more than anyone else.
sooo……what do respected players get? Usually shots, minutes, and money. So what the hell is his problem?
Please read my earlier post to get an idea of what I think of his desperate need to be loved.
david Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 5:57 pm
Kingsblade,
I read your post — especially liked the part about sending Marion to the Knicks — statue of Liberty should read : “give us your tired, old, overpaid, never satisfied athletes and we’ll trade our lottery picks for them…”
Dj hott Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 7:58 pm
space what detroit would do with marion, is put him at the 4 at still get 20pts and 11 rebs, small ball,better defender
suns will get a taller player that would have to act right, and could thrive in phoenix with amare taking the pressure off of him, and hitting outside shots,and he has won a ring, i for one thing they shouldnt trade him and will win the championship 7 games over the spurs, 6over boston
but what miami would love is a marion for a.walker,u.haslem,dorrell wright 08 pick, trade
Dj hott Said,
September 28, 2007 @ 8:09 pm
and phoenix cant trade him to atlanta for a pick, because they already own atlanta’s pick next year, for roy hibbert or derrick rose
marion to gs
marion to toronto, for kapono,garbosa,joey graham, and 2 future 1st rd picks
thats the only way toronto makes it to playoffs again
mike Said,
September 29, 2007 @ 11:04 am
if marion plays the most minutes and contributes the most and if very productive, shouldn’t he be paid the most?
david Said,
September 29, 2007 @ 11:26 am
He is !!!!
Krynn Said,
September 29, 2007 @ 11:13 pm
The Matrix to Miami? Walker’s a bust, the Suns would not make a deathtrap mistake like having his bust contract, like they learned that when they singed Banks, Wright and Haslem are good but not worth that much….
The guys in Atlanta you mentioned are far worse, you gotta be a Dallas or San Antonio fan to suggest such trades….
… at least look at what Boston traded for Garnett before making any more trade suggestions… maybe a a little less worth but but similar
m0j0 Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 4:48 am
the only thing Joe Johnson is unhappy about is how the Atlanta mgt handled the trade. He has never regretted living the Suns
Steve Kerr Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 5:58 am
Don’t blame me for this…I am a 3-point shooting GOD. the greatest player of all-time. When Mike retired, what did I do? Went to the Spurs and carried them on my shoulders to their first NBA championship…the first of many.
I working on this…but expect to see Marion still in Purple when the season starts…though getting Ron Artest AND Brad Miller for Marion and Banks would be quite nice. (even though Miller can’t run, he would help us wonderfully against low-post teams like the Spurs)
Dj hott Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 8:37 am
dj hott
G-NASHG-D.STRAWBERRY
G-R.BELLG-L.BALBOSA
F-R.ARTEST F-G.HILL
FA.STOUDEMIRE F-B.DIAW
C-B.MILLER C-?
2 ALL NBA 1ST TEAMERS
2TOP 5 DEFENDERS
3 BEST PLAYERS IN THE LEAGUE OFF THE BENCH
AND A LEGITE SIZE CENTER
SAC
G-M.BIBBY G-M.BANKS
G-K.MARTIN G-Q.DOUBY
F-S.MARION F-F.GARCIA
F.S.ABDUR RAHIM F-K.THOMAS
C-MIKKI MOORE C-S.HAWES
HOW BOUT MARION
TO NEW ORLEANS
FOR PEJA STOJAKOVIC,HILTON ARMSTRONG,AND 08PICK
coreymo Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 1:50 pm
marion to philadelphia-r.evans,r.carney,louis williams 08 pick
laker fan for life Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 2:24 pm
lakers are my favorite team but mitch is an idiot
when he traded shaq why did’nt he get some one beter that lamor and coran and brian
why did he trade coran for kwame
why did’nt he give away bynum, kwame, and farmar for JO
and why did’nt he get the matrix for odom
If he gets JO
coreymo Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 6:43 pm
if phoenix would do a marion16mil,m.banks6 mil for
artest7mil b.miller 11mil then i would do it
timmy Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 8:05 pm
i never would have though that this could have been an option… http://www.powerof15.blogspot.com
and on top of that, what about the fantasy impact?? good lord
Hammond Said,
September 30, 2007 @ 11:49 pm
The problem is simple– Amare does not play defense and gets into pointless foul trouble all the time, so he dominates weak teams and makes the ESPN slam-of-the-night all the time, but fundamentally is not a great player. Amare lost the series against the Spurs with a combination of unwise fouls and leaving the bench during the Horry scuffle, and yet Phoenix fans still worship him. The year he sat out with his knee injury, the Suns barely missed a beat. So I think Marion sees this and feels bitter… he’s not handling the situation very well, but he is right.
Jay Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 5:44 am
So what do Rashidi and the other “Matrix-lovers” suggest, Phoenix extend his contract and pay him more??? Yeah right!!! Put yourself in any owner or GM’s shoes and think: you pay more to a very good player (and whiner) and still get the same result as the previous years and Phoenix still wont win any championship. His stats are excellent but with his skills he will always be second fiddle to most superstars in the league right now and it appears that is something he doesn’t like. If he doesn’t like playing with Nash and Stoudemire what made you think he will like it more with Kobe and Kwame? So Kobe and Marion = Michael and Scottie, DREAM ON!!!
space Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 9:28 am
marions shots?
amare came off injury last year and the Suns smartly took it easy. amare’s shot count went up as the year went on. still, whenever teams could slow the suns down so they had to run a play, they went inside to amare if they weren’t swinging it around. marion on the other hand gets a number of his shots from his ridiculous rebound numbers, running the floor and virtually every break, and forcing the issue on getting open. he does have plays called for him, but i bet he can see the difference between amare’s opportunity and his.
in closing seconds the ball is in steve’s hands [as it should be of course] but as a competitor, i wouldn’t doubt marion feeling slighted that he isn’t ‘that guy’.
DJ
on the detroit thing: it is interesting, but i am not sure about that lineup. they are already small and would probably win a bunch of games, but come east conf finals and finals time, get banged around by the bigger squads.
*oh yeah, that’s the pick i was referring to. atlanta’s going to win too many games to make it REALLY worth it i think. the hawks finally have a lineup together. a sleeper team is going to rise in the east and unless something tragic happens, i expect the hawks to improve [along with the bobcats]. hibbert is slow, rose would be nice, but they honestly would be better off getting lucky and landing thabeet.
Jay
i have to love watching the suns play every game, but i seriously doubt they will win it this year unless the other stars on the other top 2 teams get injured or the get a REAL athletic big to defend and intimidate. neither has happened yet so….
gabe Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 9:50 am
steve nash won’t last the season. the suns are done! let amare play lock down d on the power forwards in the Western Conference.
Marion is best served to move on before the disappointing season. He can get an extension elsewhere.
Let the suns save money. I bet that the suns will miss matrix more than matrix misses them.
steve kerr is doing a fine job as a GM. i’d be gone if my boss said i was not worth what I was being paid for.
coreymo Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 9:55 am
marion is selfish and wants security, like rashard getting 20 mil in orlando, the matter is, he doesnt want his 16 or 13 mil phoenix may offer he wants a raise like 18, 19 mil,and another team, i think he will stay, and if they do not win a ring this year, no question he will be gone with less value,and i doubt atlanta does squad again this year, smith will get hurt, law is slow and not gauranteed starter, and if oden was only predicted to avg 9pts 8 rebs, what makes u think al hortford, who got dominated by the injuried oden, wont be just like shelden williams?atlanta should trade to get marion, but not a pick, trade,josh childress,speedy claxton,and al hortford for marion, that would be perfect,shots,reunited with johnson, the city,
or try to trade-s.claxton,josh childress,marvin williams,and 09 pick
atlanta-g-ACIE LAW G-TY LUE
G-JOE JOHNSON G-S.STOUDAMIRE
F-JOSH SMITH F-DOUG CHRISTIE
F-S.MARION F-S.WILLIAMS
C-Z.PACHULIA C-A.HORTFORD
BUT PHOENIX WOULD WANT HORTFORD
AND CHRISTIE WONT COME BACK SO IT WOULD LOOK LIKE THIS
G-A.LAW10.8PPG 5.9AST G-TY LUE
G.JOE JOHNSONG-24.8PPG G-S.STOUDAMIRE
F-JOSH SMITH-15.6PPG7.4REBS F-M.WILLIAMS
F-S.MARION-20.8PPG 10.6REBS F-S.WILLIAMS
C-Z.PACHULIA-8.8PPG 8.4REBS CROY TARPLEYOR BISON DELE
david Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 10:11 am
I guess it’s all moot as Matrix is showing up to camp, probably hanging his head and plodding down the hallway to the locker rooms with the song “16 Tons” playing in the background.
DJ HOTT Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 10:15 am
I HEARD RASHEED WALLACE DROPPED 20LBS AND IS PLAYING CENTER THIS YEAR, SHOULDNT HE GAIN 20 OR MAKE THAT 40,LOL EITHER WAY IT GOES I DO NOT THINK DETROIT IS A TOP 4 TEAM IN THE EAST ANYMORE AND MARION WILL STAY IN PHOENIX FOR NOW, IF NOT HE WOULD WANT TO GO TO LA, OR ONE OF THE TOP 4 TEAMS IN THE EAST-OUTSIDE OF BOSTON
SO-CLEVELAND,RESIGNE PAVLOVIC AND VIERAJO AND TRADE THEM FOR MARION, OR CHICAGO TRADE MARION FOR BEN WALLACE,NY TRADE DAVID LEE,NATE ROBINSON AND JEFFRIES FOR HIM,
CHICAGO-G-HINRICH G-DUHON
GB.GORDON G-S.THABOSHA
F-LOUL DENG F-A.NOCIONI
F-MARION F-T.THOMAS
C-JOE SMITH C-J.NOAH
WOULD U ADD THE CENTER DEFENDER MOST UNSELFISH PLAYER, IN THE LEAGUE WHO GETS PAID 15MIL-WITH 3 YEARS LEFT AND WILL EITHER RETIRE OR TAKE A PAY CUT THEN, OR MARION WHO GETS PAID 1 MILLION MORE FOR 2 MORE YEARS OR A RAISE &WHINING IN THE COMING YEARS,-CHICAGO GETS AN ALLSTAR AND A GOLDENSTATE TYPE OF APPROACH TO BEAT BOSTON, CLEVELAND ROSTER
G-D.GIBSON G-E.SNOW
G-L.JAMES G-D.JONES
F-S.MARION F-L.HUGHES
F-D.GOODEN F-D.MARSHALL
C-Z.ILGAUSKUS C-SHEWN KEMP
NICE
MIAMI-TRADE-U.HASLEM,D.WRIGHT,D.COOK,EXPIRING J.WILLIAMS, FOR MARION-MIAMI-G.S.PARKER
GD.WADE
F-A.WALKER
F-MARION
C-S.ONEAL
JUST WHAT MIAMI NEEDS, AND PHONEIX ADD 2 YOUNG GUYS OK HASLEM AND EXPIRING 8MIL IN A YEAR OFF JWILL
DJ HOTT Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 10:27 am
ID EITHER KEEP MARION, OR CONVINCE THE BULLS TO TRADE MARION FOR WALLACE, I THINK WALLACE WOULD BE THE ANSWER FOR PHOENIX, NOT CHICAGO,DUNCAN VS WALLACE AND AMARE
PHOENIX-G-S.NASH G-M.BANKS
G-R.BELL G-L.BARBOSA
F-G.HILL F-A.TUCKER
F-A.STOUDEMIRE F-B.DIAW
C-B.WALLACE B.SKINNER
AMARE GETS ALL THE SHOTS HE WANTS, AND LESS FOULS
BARBOSA WILL GET TO SCORE MORE,HILL WILL CONTRIBUTE,AS WELL AS DIAW,WALLACE WILL DEFEND AND AGAIN AVERAGE 13REBS,NASH WILL LEAD THEM TO FINALS, WITH BEN WALLACE-MARION IS THE REASON THEY CANT WIN, HE DOESNT WANT IT ENOUGH, MARION SHOULD HAVE AVERAGED 22 9 VS THE SPURS AGAINST OBERTO,
ITS NOT MARIONS FAULT HE IS AN ALLSTAR, BUT A WHINER,AND KINDA LIKE DIRK NOWITZKI,
Kingsblade Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 10:46 am
lol…Space you sound like you are Marion’s apologist or something. Are you actually trying to say that Marion got off something like 1100 shots from offensive rebounds and fast breaks?
First let me point out that Stoudemire had more offensive rebounds than Marion, and since more of his came close to the basket than Marion it is more than likely that he had more shot attempts coming from rebounds than Marion did.
Second, the Suns averaged about 17 fast break points per game. It is hard to determine how many shots come from the fast break from this, but since the fast break usually has a very high efficiency we could call it at most 12. With Barbosa and Bell also getting quite a few shot on the break (and yes even Stoudemire)and Nash pulling up on the break at least once or twice a game, Marion is left with maybe 3 or 4 fast break attempts per game at the very most.
…and even if he did take most of his shots on the break you have to take into account the importance the Suns put on the fast break. They consider it one of the most important parts of their offense (why have a passing point of you don’t open up the floor). Why would he be upset at getting the most attempts during what they consider to be the most important part of their offense?
He took more shots than anyone on the team except for Barbosa, and to try and write that off and say he only got shots because of this or that is a joke. Shots are shot, and he took enough high quality shots to lead this team in scoring.(especially if, as you say, they came from offensive rebounds and fast breaks). Instead he was fourth.
The problem with Marion is the fact that he is a born utility player. One of the best perhaps, but he does not have either the tools or the disposition to lead a team and he really needs to stop crying about it because the more he goes on the worse he looks. He is the only one who looks bad in this scenario, and his constant quest for recognition (which he has received in spades by being paid extremely well, playing the most minutes, playing in 4 all star games, and even being on an Olympic team) is tiresome at best.
gabe Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 11:32 am
seems most suns fans don’t value what marion has given over the years.
you whine that he is paid to much. seems that he plays and HUSTLES just as much or more as anyone out there. he rarely has an easy defensive assignment (don’t forget defense is important too). he rarely misses a game. to me he is the most complete player on the suns roster. nash is weak on d, and amare is mediocre.
suns did no better this past year in the playoffs then then the year before. how did amare help? spurs beat the suns. everyone knows the rules, and they haven’t changed this year!
space Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 4:03 pm
i’m not going to martyr myself for marion let’s straighten that out but give the guy his due. whiner or not.
not accurate on the board factor KING— marion outrebounded stoudamire last season.
stoudamire averaged 9.6 compared to marion’s 9.8. the difference on the offensive glass between them was literally only half a rebound a game [.5].
marion does score in the flow of the offense, and it appears that he has the green light, but in their half court sets [which they are pressed into to keep them from running] they swing & rotate until a guy gets an opening or try to drop into amare. i am simply saying that it’s a far cry from the laker’s, get kobe the ball scenario. marion is NOT going to get it in that situation, but might feel like he should get the kobe treatment. i’m not on the court with them at crunch time, but i can guess he a guy who shoots over 50% percent might want kobe treatment… hell, even i want kobe treatment.
Larry Edmond Said,
October 1, 2007 @ 9:52 pm
Kobe,Marion,Lamar,Fisher and our centers would be a hard team to deal with - Kobe more than any one this season would love to win a title he wants to prove that the lakers made a mistake by letting him walk away when this season is completed.
Kingsblade Said,
October 2, 2007 @ 5:55 pm
@space:
Can you read? I said Stoudemire had more OFFENSIVE rebounds. What exactly is inaccurate about that? I was true. Unless you are claiming that Marion was shooting putbacks from their own end. Even if the difference was minimal (which is true) it still makes my point. Regardless of your feelings on the matter Stoudemire had more putback opportunities than Marion does. Even if they were tied it still makes my point for me…you tried to claim that a large chunk of his attempts came from offensive rebounds and I was demonstrating that a very similar chunk of Stoudemire’s came from the same source…yet Marion still had more attempts.
Your other point about him wanting to be the go to guy in crunch time…it is never going to happen no matter which team he plays for and maybe its time that either his agent or some of his friends exp[lain the truth to him(If he has any left). He does not have the tools nor the decision making ability to be that guy. Everyone wishes they were Kobe…but not everyone demands a trade from a top tier team, on which they play the most minutes and get paid the most (and even get mentioned as a possible MVP candidate), because they think they ARE Kobe. I said this before in a another blog, but does he really think that going to another team will get to the next level where he WINS MVP? Ridiculous.
DJ HOTT Said,
October 3, 2007 @ 4:16 pm
marion is a hair better than josh howard,tayshaun prince,rip hamilton,r.jefferson, hes not on a kobe,lebron,carmelo,dwade,nash,iverson,v.carter,tmac,garnett level,
marion is good, but not clutch at all, he is not who u want to have the ball to take the last shot, nor could he create his own shot in the clutch,marion got enough shots, i just think it was a publicity stunt like kobe, and marion will thrive next to ghill passing him the ball,if marion has a problem, he should discuss it in practice, or to his teammates, not publicely, thats shows no respect to his teammates,and he is in no position to complain,i think he will stay, or go to memphis, in a hakeem warrick,d.stoudamire,stromile swift, trade
not to bad in memphis, were in playoffs 2years ago, play along,gasol,and mike miller,pg conley,big man darko,versitale rudy gay, as many shots as he wants, a shooter at the 2,apasser at the 1,and a bigman were as phoenix will want a pick, or will be doing memphis a favor
DJ HOTT Said,
October 3, 2007 @ 4:29 pm
COULD PHOENIX DO ANYTHING WITH A 2PG LOOK-A MARION FOR KIDD TRADE, OR A MARION FOR B.DAVIS
NASH AND KIDD IN THE BACKCOURT
OR BETTER YET NASH AND BARON DAVIS
LETS SAY KIDD SAYS HE LOVES NJ BUT IS FINE WITH ONLY A TRADE TO PHOENIX, AND OR LETS SAY B.DAVIS DEMANDS A 18MIL CONTRACT,AND GS DECLINES AND HARRINGTON AND B.WRIGHTS NOT ENOUGH,
M.WILLIAMS 9.8PPG 7.7ASTS G-EARL BOYKINS
V.CARTER 23.8PPG G-A.WRIGHT
R.JEFFERSON 18.8PPG F-C.ROBINSON
S.MARION 19.2 9.6REBS F-J.BOONE
N.KRYSTIC C-12.8 8.6J.MCGLOIRE
I DONT KNOW HOW, BUT SOME HOW PHOENIX COULD WORK WITH A KIDD AT THE 1 NASH AT THE 2 BACKCOURT, BUT DEFINATELY WOULD LOOK NICE WITH A NASH AND BDIDDY BACKCOURT, BUT HEY LETS KEEP IT REAL, THERE IS NO BACKCOURT IN THE LEAGUE THAT COULD HANDLE A STEVE NASH BARON DAVIS BACKCOURT, THATS HOW IT WOULD HAVE BEEN IF LA WOULD HAVE GOTTEN JASON KIDD, BUT INSTEAD WE WATCH BYNUM IMPROVE TO 10PPG 8REBS, AND KWAME GET HURT AGAIN
DJ HOTT Said,
October 3, 2007 @ 4:55 pm
TOP 12 OVERRATED PLAYERS TOP 10 UNDERRATED
1.S.MARION 1.Z.RANDOLPH
2.R.LEWIS 2.J.RICHARDSON
3.GREG ODEN 3.E.OKAFOR
4.NENE 4.H.WARRICK
5.LAMAR ODOM 5.S.JACKSON
6.DIRK NOWITZKI 6.B.GORDON
7.RASHEED WALLACE 7.DAVID LEE
8.DARKO MILILIC 8.L.BARBOSA
9.JAMEER NELSON 9.MONTA ELLIS
10.JACQUE VAUGHN 10.F.OBERTO
11.R.ALSTON
12.MIKE JAMES
STEP UP SEASON
1.CHRIS WILCOX
2.C.FRYE
3.L.ALDRIGE
4.A.MORRISON
5.A.BYNUM
6.M.WILLIAMS
7.RANDY FOYE
8.C.VILLANOVA
9.H.WARRICK
10.BRANDON ROY
11.STEVE FRANCIS
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